2024 Season: Brake Hardware Recap

[J1Avs]

I've had a pretty fun and successful season with the FL5 in the Pacific Northwest (to include a P1 in Global Time Attack's Enthusiast Class and new FWD Class Record), and a great deal of that came from consistent, confident, and long-lasting brakes.

I see TONS of questions, feedback, and complaints about people's setups -- so I figured I'd go into a bit more detail of what my 2024 season looked like, what equipment I used, how it performed, and it how long it lasted; ultimately, hoping it helps at least someone with their choices for the 2025 season. I also think it's important to show that only minor changes can net strong results without investing in an aftermarket BBK, just by choosing the right equipment.

TLDR: CSG Spec C1X/CE1 + Girodiscs ROCK.

So how much did I drive this year?

• 21 Track Days!
• 532 Laps!
  • 500 @ Ridge Motorsports Park
  • 32 @ Pacific Raceways
• 1307 Miles on Track
• 4000+ Street Miles

*Note -- I ran all of these laps in +R with Long Hold (i.e., TC OFF and VSA OFF). Approximately 10 were done in Pedal Dance, and approximately 20 done with VSA ON.

Why is all this important -- well, Ridge is Fast, with 5 heavy brake zones. So, it does pretty good work on the braking system.

So with that context set, what equipment did I use?

• Pads - Counterspace Garage/CSG Spec -- CP(Front/Rear) -- TestCompound(Front)/CP(Rear) -- USED C1(Front)/CE1(Rear) -- C1X(Front)/CE1(Rear)
• Rotors - Girodisc (Front and Rear)
• Brake Lines - Stock
• Titanium Shims - N/A

PADS - Counterspace Garage (CSG Spec)
Every CSG compound tested performed incredible, without fade over the course of a session -- even the "Street" compound, the CP. Excellent modulation and release, and the complete opposite of the On/Off switch that plagues so many other pads.

The C1X is the newest compound for the FL5, and I have been on it, both on track and street driving, since GTA in August 2024 -- and it's ABSOLUTELY my new favorite.

• Laps: 182 at Ridge
• Track Days: 8 Track Days
• Track Sessions: 30 on-track sessions
• Street Miles: 1000+

After all of that, every pad, from every angle (Outer/Inner/Top/Bottom) still had over 5.0mm of pad life remaining. Given the pad has a 5.0mm backing plate, and comes with ~10.mm of a pad material, there's still quite a bit of life left, since we have only used 50% of the material. Will I go down to sub 2mm, likely not intentionally, but 10 Track Days with 225 Laps on C1X looks promising, and an excellent value.

C1X Measurements Taken on 11/30:

• Passenger Outside
  • 11.2 - 11.6 - 12.3 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.1 - 10.5 - 11.4 (Top to Bot - OUT)
• Passenger Inside
  • 10.6 - 10.6 - 10.7 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.2 - 10.2 - 10.4 (Top to Bot - OUT)
• Driver Outside
  • 11.1 - 11.6 - 12.1 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.0 - 10.4 - 11.1 (Top to Bot - OUT)
• Driver Inside
  • 10.7 - 10.7 - 11.0 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.1 - 10.2 - 10.5 (Top to Bot - OUT)

**Note -- I rotated the pads back in September about 33% through this use to balance taper. I swapped Driver Outside to Passenger Inside and Driver Inside to Passenger Outside.

CE1 Rear Compound
These pads have AT LEAST 353 laps on them with me. They were a used set from a friend who did 4 or 5 track days, and IIRC, used VSA during these days. I have not yet measured these pads, but based on a visual, the wear bar is still visible and prominent.

***Note -- I did not track laps/sessions/days on the C1/CP/TestCompound -- but they CP lasted admirably (5-6 Days) for a Street Compound with low dust, and the thermal capacity to take abuse. These still had life left, but I moved on to test additional compounds. They are still on a shelf in my garage to use as emergency backups -- so still alive for sure!

ROTORS - GIRODISC

Girodisc Rotors -- Front and Rear. They were put on in February, and the same set have been on the car ALL SEASON. That's:

• 21 Track Days
• 532 Laps
• 1307 Miles on Track
• 4000+ Street Miles

Measurements

• Front - 31.2mm (Min Thickness is 30.0) (New is 32.25 - per photos I've seen)
• Rear - 10.6mm (Min Thickness is 9.0)

That's an incredible wear rate and value for how much use they had all year.
---

So that's it -- long season -- lot of driving on track, lots of ferry rides/driving to and from the track, some new hardware to show off, and discovered what can easily be a full season pad and multi-season rotor for many, or a half season pad + full season rotor for a power user.

****Sad Note -- I now have a bit of red bleed on my "Brembo" lettering thanks to a friend who drove my car for one session. If it wasn't for that, they would still be perfectly white!!

Hope this helps with people's decisions as they start planning for 2025

 

[REDRAGN]

Great data and love the effort you put into logging it all. Congrats on the record!

Any reason why you decided against the Ti shims?

What fluid did you run?

Any brake venting other than stock? (appears your dust shields are still on)

 

[J1Avs]

Great data and love the effort you put into logging it all. Congrats on the record!

Any reason why you decided against the Ti shims?

What fluid did you run?

Any brake venting other than stock? (appears your dust shields are still on)

Thanks!

The pads and rotors are both very thermal efficient and don't pass nearly as much heat into the caliper, so it wasn't something really needed.

Castrol SRF -- bled a new bottle through about halfway through the season

No changes to venting or dust shield, other than trimming the passenger side duct for the EVS front tow hook.

 

[REDRAGN]

Thanks!

The pads and rotors are both very thermal efficient and don't pass nearly as much heat into the caliper, so it wasn't something really needed.

Castrol SRF -- bled a new bottle through about halfway through the season

No changes to venting or dust shield, other than trimming the passenger side duct for the EVS front tow hook.

Nice...cant say enough for the Castrol SRF

 

[BigBird]

Great data and love the effort you put into logging it all. Congrats on the record!

Any reason why you decided against the Ti shims?

What fluid did you run?

Any brake venting other than stock? (appears your dust shields are still on)

The Paragon Ti shims are pretty terrible and super thin, i wouldn't waste my money on those.

There was this Russian vendor that had a much thicker shim, I have to find them again as they were great on my VW.

 

[BigBird]

I've had a pretty fun and successful season with the FL5 in the Pacific Northwest (to include a P1 in Global Time Attack's Enthusiast Class and new FWD Class Record), and a great deal of that came from consistent, confident, and long-lasting brakes.

I see TONS of questions, feedback, and complaints about people's setups -- so I figured I'd go into a bit more detail of what my 2024 season looked like, what equipment I used, how it performed, and it how long it lasted; ultimately, hoping it helps at least someone with their choices for the 2025 season. I also think it's important to show that only minor changes can net strong results without investing in an aftermarket BBK, just by choosing the right equipment.

TLDR: CSG Spec C1X/CE1 + Girodiscs ROCK.

So how much did I drive this year?

• 21 Track Days!
• 532 Laps!
  • 500 @ Ridge Motorsports Park
  • 32 @ Pacific Raceways
• 1307 Miles on Track
• 4000+ Street Miles

*Note -- I ran all of these laps in +R with Long Hold (i.e., TC OFF and VSA OFF). Approximately 10 were done in Pedal Dance, and approximately 20 done with VSA ON.

Why is all this important -- well, Ridge is Fast, with 5 heavy brake zones. So, it does pretty good work on the braking system.

So with that context set, what equipment did I use?

• Pads - Counterspace Garage/CSG Spec -- CP(Front/Rear) -- TestCompound(Front)/CP(Rear) -- USED C1(Front)/CE1(Rear) -- C1X(Front)/CE1(Rear)
• Rotors - Girodisc (Front and Rear)
• Brake Lines - Stock
• Titanium Shims - N/A

PADS - Counterspace Garage (CSG Spec)
Every CSG compound tested performed incredible, without fade over the course of a session -- even the "Street" compound, the CP. Excellent modulation and release, and the complete opposite of the On/Off switch that plagues so many other pads.

The C1X is the newest compound for the FL5, and I have been on it, both on track and street driving, since GTA in August 2024 -- and it's ABSOLUTELY my new favorite.

• Laps: 182 at Ridge
• Track Days: 8 Track Days
• Track Sessions: 30 on-track sessions
• Street Miles: 1000+

After all of that, every pad, from every angle (Outer/Inner/Top/Bottom) still had over 5.0mm of pad life remaining. Given the pad has a 5.0mm backing plate, and comes with ~10.mm of a pad material, there's still quite a bit of life left, since we have only used 50% of the material. Will I go down to sub 2mm, likely not intentionally, but 10 Track Days with 225 Laps on C1X looks promising, and an excellent value.

C1X Measurements Taken on 11/30:

• Passenger Outside
  • 11.2 - 11.6 - 12.3 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.1 - 10.5 - 11.4 (Top to Bot - OUT)
• Passenger Inside
  • 10.6 - 10.6 - 10.7 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.2 - 10.2 - 10.4 (Top to Bot - OUT)
• Driver Outside
  • 11.1 - 11.6 - 12.1 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.0 - 10.4 - 11.1 (Top to Bot - OUT)
• Driver Inside
  • 10.7 - 10.7 - 11.0 (Top to Bot - IN)
  • 10.1 - 10.2 - 10.5 (Top to Bot - OUT)

**Note -- I rotated the pads back in September about 33% through this use to balance taper. I swapped Driver Outside to Passenger Inside and Driver Inside to Passenger Outside.

CE1 Rear Compound
These pads have AT LEAST 353 laps on them with me. They were a used set from a friend who did 4 or 5 track days, and IIRC, used VSA during these days. I have not yet measured these pads, but based on a visual, the wear bar is still visible and prominent.

***Note -- I did not track laps/sessions/days on the C1/CP/TestCompound -- but they CP lasted admirably (5-6 Days) for a Street Compound with low dust, and the thermal capacity to take abuse. These still had life left, but I moved on to test additional compounds. They are still on a shelf in my garage to use as emergency backups -- so still alive for sure!

ROTORS - GIRODISC

Girodisc Rotors -- Front and Rear. They were put on in February, and the same set have been on the car ALL SEASON. That's:

• 21 Track Days
• 532 Laps
• 1307 Miles on Track
• 4000+ Street Miles

Measurements

• Front - 31.2mm (Min Thickness is 30.0) (New is 32.25 - per photos I've seen)
• Rear - 10.6mm (Min Thickness is 9.0)

That's an incredible wear rate and value for how much use they had all year.
---

So that's it -- long season -- lot of driving on track, lots of ferry rides/driving to and from the track, some new hardware to show off, and discovered what can easily be a full season pad and multi-season rotor for many, or a half season pad + full season rotor for a power user.

****Sad Note -- I now have a bit of red bleed on my "Brembo" lettering thanks to a friend who drove my car for one session. If it wasn't for that, they would still be perfectly white!!

Hope this helps with people's decisions as they start planning for 2025

Great write up!

looks like you'll need some dust boots. Wonder if the Racing brake high temp ones will hold up. Some say they work and others don't

 

[J1Avs]

Great write up!

looks like you'll need some dust boots. Wonder if the Racing brake high temp ones will hold up. Some say they work and others don't

They will be fine for a bit. My A90 boots were way worse after 3+ years. I'll likely rebuild a fresh set with Girodisc's kit at some point.

 

[TARZAN]

Great write up!

looks like you'll need some dust boots. Wonder if the Racing brake high temp ones will hold up. Some say they work and others don't

Long time lurker, first time posting.

Firstly to OP: very informational, thank you!

Regarding the Racing Brake higher temp rated dust boots: have not used them on the FL5, but coming from a MK7 GTI that had Porsche Macan 4 piston Brembo front calipers (which took the same 1001 pad pattern), they did not do well in my experience.

Pictures show new vs after ~7 track days. Unfortunately only took pictures of one side, but I recall having one boot so torn with a good chunk hanging, I had to rip part of it off before replacing pads.

At this time I was mostly at a novice level, moving into intermediate later that season, so some of the wear could be attributed to dragging the brakes and overall poor braking habits at the start. Looking at their site later, I found out that they put out a disclaimer that they do not recommend using any grease and avoiding contact with brake fluid which I find a little absurd (and did not see at the time of ordering).

One of my track instructors with a faster car and similar brake setup was also going through boots seasonally. He tried a brand called BCB and had better luck with it this season with no rips or signs of scorching. It appears they are a small China based operation where you can buy directly through facebook/instagram as per their YouTube channel. Not sure if they sell the exact size for the FL5, but I hope the GiroDisc ones last a while as they are a trusted name.

On the GTI, I installed the higher temp Racing Brake boots when the calipers were brand new, as I disassembled them for powder coating. Ran with Hawk DTC-60 (and HPS 5.0 pads in a pinch), with Neuspeed titanium shims on OE 340mm blank rotors with Techna Fit stainless lines, Castrol SRF and Audi RS3 brake air ducts.

.

 

[BigBird]

Long time lurker, first time posting.

Firstly to OP: very informational, thank you!

Regarding the Racing Brake higher temp rated dust boots: have not used them on the FL5, but coming from a MK7 GTI that had Porsche Macan 4 piston Brembo front calipers (which took the same 1001 pad pattern), they did not do well in my experience.

Pictures show new vs after ~7 track days. Unfortunately only took pictures of one side, but I recall having one boot so torn with a good chunk hanging, I had to rip part of it off before replacing pads.

At this time I was mostly at a novice level, moving into intermediate later that season, so some of the wear could be attributed to dragging the brakes and overall poor braking habits at the start. Looking at their site later, I found out that they put out a disclaimer that they do not recommend using any grease and avoiding contact with brake fluid which I find a little absurd (and did not see at the time of ordering).

One of my track instructors with a faster car and similar brake setup was also going through boots seasonally. He tried a brand called BCB and had better luck with it this season with no rips or signs of scorching. It appears they are a small China based operation where you can buy directly through facebook/instagram as per their YouTube channel. Not sure if they sell the exact size for the FL5, but I hope the GiroDisc ones last a while as they are a trusted name.

On the GTI, I installed the higher temp Racing Brake boots when the calipers were brand new, as I disassembled them for powder coating. Ran with Hawk DTC-60 (and HPS 5.0 pads in a pinch), with Neuspeed titanium shims on OE 340mm blank rotors with Techna Fit stainless lines, Castrol SRF and Audi RS3 brake air ducts.

.

Hey! I too come from the MK7/7.5 world having a manual MK7 GTI Sport, then a DSG IS38 GTI, then a 7.5 Golf R 'Stage 2' FBO with Bilstein coilovers, all the bushings replaced, etc.

I had the Macan calipers, but never worked out for me. The pad knockback and feel was not for me. I ended up just getting a Stoptech ST-60 6 Piston kit and that was amazing. Probably the best mod for the car outside the coilovers.

I haven't really put this car through its paces like the Golf R, so hopefully the calipers will work better on this platform. I did see that Racing Brake said no grease, so I guess the jury is still out if they actually work, but the other company you mentioned might be worth a try.

 

[MooMoo]

the pragon shims are definitely very thin but they have to help some? I wonder if there is some data on this because that could make a huge difference on longevity of the boots..

I was reading somewhere that stainless steel actually can handle heat better than titanium, it has higher thermal conductivity, not by a lot but its there

 

[BigBird]

the pragon shims are definitely very thin but they have to help some? I wonder if there is some data on this because that could make a huge difference on longevity of the boots..

I was reading somewhere that stainless steel actually can handle heat better than titanium, it has higher thermal conductivity, not by a lot but its there

I ordered from the company I got my first set from. If they come in, I'll share the link. They have both a .6 and .8mm thickness option...I ordered the .8

Fingers crossed they still in business

 

[MooMoo]

Is it a russian company?

how thick are the paragon ones do we know?

 

[BigBird]

Is it a russian company?

how thick are the paragon ones do we know?

Russian yeah

Paragon are super thin, next time I'll measure them with a caliper.

 

[MooMoo]

lol yeah I remember seeing those but I think at the time was right when the war had started and I don't think they were shipping (or maybe I am confusing with another russian product lol but I definitely remember seing those.

The paragons are definitely less than .8

To be fair to paragon too think and they will be a pain to put on when the pad is new, its arleady pretty tight in there iirc

 

[J1Avs]

the pragon shims are definitely very thin but they have to help some? I wonder if there is some data on this because that could make a huge difference on longevity of the boots..

I was reading somewhere that stainless steel actually can handle heat better than titanium, it has higher thermal conductivity, not by a lot but its there

I'm sure they may help on certain pads that are not focused on thermal efficiency and bleed a ton of heat into the calipers. But if the data shows it's not needed for all, that's money better spent elsewhere, than adding another factor into the equation.

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