Aftermarket tire experience

[optronix]

The DWS06 are a great all season tire. But they do not compare to the PS4S for grip or road feel.

Here in the mid-Atlantic our winters can get quite cold, and while I don't have a necessity to drive in snow, I do need my car when it's below 40 degrees, which is generally not advisable to be driving on a summer tire. So I love the DWS06 for that- there isn't too much of a compromise vs the PS4S.

But I swapped back to the Michelins in April, and noticed a very clear and distinct difference right away. I do autocross my car and wouldn't consider the DWS06 at all for that, but even on the street I vastly prefer the Michelins.

This is where you need to ask yourself what your plan for the winter is. You didn't mention a location, so I'm not sure if you're going to attempt to drive on summer tires in the winter months if it routinely dips below 40 degrees. I wouldn't recommend it. In the northern states, all seasons would be the minimum- I'd actually consider a set of dedicated winter tires for the colder months.

If you don't want to deal with swapping out tires, and don't really value the extra confidence and feel you get from the Michelins, then sure, the DWS06 are a very good option. You could also consider the Michelin A/S4, arguably an even better all-season option that probably would be available in a good size for 18s (they're not available in OEM 19" sizes which is why I chose the DWS06).

But if you want to maintain the grip and feel of the car as it came from the factory, you should strongly consider maintaining a summer tire. For that, the Extreme Sport 02 is the equivalent of the PS4S. Might be a little cheaper, and many folks have claimed they like them- but I think in most practical tests they are still the inferior option to the Michelin.

As others have stated, stay away from any of the 200 treadwear options. You can even get away with doing track stuff on the PS4S- only consider an "upgrade" to 200 TW if you're concerned with going faster in timed events. For almost all other use cases, the "normal" summer tires (e.g., PS4S) will be the better option.

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[rui]

The DWS06 are a great all season tire. But they do not compare to the PS4S for grip or road feel.

Here in the mid-Atlantic our winters can get quite cold, and while I don't have a necessity to drive in snow, I do need my car when it's below 40 degrees, which is generally not advisable to be driving on a summer tire. So I love the DWS06 for that- there isn't too much of a compromise vs the PS4S.

But I swapped back to the Michelins in April, and noticed a very clear and distinct difference right away. I do autocross my car and wouldn't consider the DWS06 at all for that, but even on the street I vastly prefer the Michelins.

This is where you need to ask yourself what your plan for the winter is. You didn't mention a location, so I'm not sure if you're going to attempt to drive on summer tires in the winter months if it routinely dips below 40 degrees. I wouldn't recommend it. In the northern states, all seasons would be the minimum- I'd actually consider a set of dedicated winter tires for the colder months.

If you don't want to deal with swapping out tires, and don't really value the extra confidence and feel you get from the Michelins, then sure, the DWS06 are a very good option. You could also consider the Michelin A/S4, arguably an even better all-season option that probably would be available in a good size for 18s (they're not available in OEM 19" sizes which is why I chose the DWS06).

But if you want to maintain the grip and feel of the car as it came from the factory, you should strongly consider maintaining a summer tire. For that, the Extreme Sport 02 is the equivalent of the PS4S. Might be a little cheaper, and many folks have claimed they like them- but I think in most practical tests they are still the inferior option to the Michelin.

As others have stated, stay away from any of the 200 treadwear options. You can even get away with doing track stuff on the PS4S- only consider an "upgrade" to 200 TW if you're concerned with going faster in timed events. For almost all other use cases, the "normal" summer tires (e.g., PS4S) will be the better option.

Just to be clear, you're comparing the Michelin PS4S and Continental DWS06+ in the FL5 factory 265/30 R19 size?

I ask because downsizing to 18" will have inherent performance disadvantages, regardless of tire model. I confess I don't understand what the OP is trying to achieve by downsizing for canyon driving.

 

[optronix]

Just to be clear, you're comparing the Michelin PS4S and Continental DWS06+ in the FL5 factory 265/30 R19 size?

I ask because downsizing to 18" will have inherent performance disadvantages, regardless of tire model. I confess I don't understand what the OP is trying to achieve by downsizing for canyon driving.

Yeah, my comparison is with the OEM sizes, on the OEM Integra Type S wheels. It's more of a general comparison because lots of folk started suggesting the DWS06/+ and I wanted to be clear that it's a downgrade as far as driving sensations and capabilities are concerned. Personally, I agree- I chose this platform because of the driving dynamics. Actively choosing to negate much of that through tire choice outside of necessity for the winter months is not something I'd consider, but I do get having the convenience of not having to swap wheels/tires every 6 months.

Lots of folks also downsize to 18s, and there are pros and cons associated with that. My consensus is both wheel and tire availability, especially in 18 x 9.5 +45 and 265/35 18, is far better than the 19" choices available, and from a performance standpoint I don't think there are any particular disadvantages with the 18s, assuming you stick with a like for like tire.

I will add though that changing virtually anything regarding the OEM chassis is going to be noticeable. I just opted to stick with 19s, going with Apex VS-5RS wheels in +45 offset. It made a larger difference in steering feel than I'd hoped for. I adjusted relatively quickly and it doesn't bother me per se, but it definitely did make an impact. Downsizing to 18s would probably make a larger impact, so that's something to consider. At least one other member has commented that they did not like the steering feel with 18 x 9.5 +45, and went back to OEM.

 

[Tougefl5]

Just to be clear, you're comparing the Michelin PS4S and Continental DWS06+ in the FL5 factory 265/30 R19 size?

I ask because downsizing to 18" will have inherent performance disadvantages, regardless of tire model. I confess I don't understand what the OP is trying to achieve by downsizing for canyon driving.

Not being disrespectful. However is it that you don't understand how physics work with unsprung weight.
Or perhaps that more sidewall is a advantage on roads with bumps or the occasional drop of the pavement.

Big difference in car set up in one's head vs actually setting up a car irl.

 

[katch922]

Biggest negative I have for stock CTR tires is driving in rain. It does hydroplane a lot and I def do not feel confident pushing the car over 110-120kph in rain. I had a 21 golf r and I can’t remember what tires it had, it was continental extreme sport or something, but I def felt more confident in rain. I’ve also owned pilot super sports on genesis coup and those did better in wet as well, and pretty similar in dry at least for daily use.

You’d have dedicated tires for track imo, so for daily I personally would not buy the CTR stock tires. If you live somewhere dry, barely any rain, I think they are awesome, but we get a lot of rain here so for me they wouldn’t be my first choice.

That being said, maybe it’s just the fact that CTR is FWD?

 

[optronix]

Not being disrespectful. However is it that you don't understand how physics work with unsprung weight.
Or perhaps that more sidewall is a advantage on roads with bumps or the occasional drop of the pavement.

Big difference in car set up in one's head vs actually setting up a car irl.

I think the point is that for canyon/"non-race" types of driving, the differences aren't really going to be that pronounced.

Ride quality/pothole survivability? Yeah, probably an advantage with 18s, but I'm not aware of any scientific evidence to suggest quantifiably just how much of an advantage.

For me personally, I don't like the way the DE5 looks with 18s, and it's as simple as that. For whatever reason, the FL5 looks fine with either 18s or 19s, and I would have very likely just done 18s if I had an FL5.

Biggest negative I have for stock CTR tires is driving in rain. It does hydroplane a lot and I def do not feel confident pushing the car over 110-120kph in rain. I had a 21 golf r and I can’t remember what tires it had, it was continental extreme sport or something, but I def felt more confident in rain. I’ve also owned pilot super sports on genesis coup and those did better in wet as well, and pretty similar in dry at least for daily use.

You’d have dedicated tires for track imo, so for daily I personally would not buy the CTR stock tires. If you live somewhere dry, barely any rain, I think they are awesome, but we get a lot of rain here so for me they wouldn’t be my first choice.

That being said, maybe it’s just the fact that CTR is FWD?

This has not been my experience. The PS4S is perfectly capable in the wet- of course assuming you're not driving in torrential conditions where any tire would struggle. I've done several autocrosses and track events now on this tire in the wet in multiple cars, and it performs wonderfully.

Also FWIW, the Pilot Sport 4S is a comprehensive evolution of the Pilot Super Sport, and thus conceptually (and scientifically) should be better in every category.

 

[katch922]

I think the point is that for canyon/"non-race" types of driving, the differences aren't really going to be that pronounced.

Ride quality/pothole survivability? Yeah, probably an advantage with 18s, but I'm not aware of any scientific evidence to suggest quantifiably just how much of an advantage.

For me personally, I don't like the way the DE5 looks with 18s, and it's as simple as that. For whatever reason, the FL5 looks fine with either 18s or 19s, and I would have very likely just done 18s if I had an FL5.



This has not been my experience. The PS4S is perfectly capable in the wet- of course assuming you're not driving in torrential conditions where any tire would struggle. I've done several autocrosses and track events now on this tire in the wet in multiple cars, and it performs wonderfully.

Also FWIW, the Pilot Sport 4S is a comprehensive evolution of the Pilot Super Sport, and thus conceptually (and scientifically) should be better in every category.

Not sure must be the fact it’s FWD, and yes I am more or less talking about a decent amount of standing water. I haven’t experienced this in my golf r in same conditions, and for some reason I remember my genesis coup give me hell of a lot more confidence as well with super sports.

Genesis came with some Bridgestone perf tires those were bloody awful in dry and rain.

 

[rui]

Not being disrespectful. However is it that you don't understand how physics work with unsprung weight.
Or perhaps that more sidewall is a advantage on roads with bumps or the occasional drop of the pavement.

Big difference in car set up in one's head vs actually setting up a car irl.

Hi there. No need to get offensive and ad hominem.

I hope you find what you're looking for.

The Michelin PS4 S is really the best tire in its class. If you want to mitigate the disadvantages of downsizing you can go up to a Bridgestone RE-71 RS. But that class of tire brings its own compromises in noise, durability, etc.

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