2022 Civic Touring Sedan beats out 5 rivals : Mazda 3, Jetta, Elantra, Sentra, Corolla [Car and Driver Competition]

[MorrisGray]

Fuelly says Mazda3 is 29.8 vs. Honda's 33.4 so it's not such a big difference. The Mazda3 hatch would definitely be 2nd on my list of hatches to buy, I admit I'm tired of Civic road noise it's very annoying I don't know how much better the Mazda would be. Probably can't lose with a new manual Mazda3 but do their hatches come with a manual option? I notice Doug DeMuro gave the Mazda3 hatch a Doug score of 51 but the 2022 Civic EX Sedan only got a 40!

Problem with Mazda3 ... Manual is only available in one trim ... Premium Hatchback ... No lower trims at all and not in any sedan!
Quiet? Yes the Mazda3 Premium Hatchback is very quiet. I just didn't feel any excitement driving it compared to my 2006 smaller engine 5 speed sedan. I was expecting more. I like Mazda3 having the naturally aspirated motor and would have definitely bought a Mazda3 sedan if they had a manual. I am unsure about the Hatchback model for looks and back seat room. Just me.
... I did try an SI last year and I loved the way it drove. But I have never owned a turbo assisted motor and was unsure whether I wanted to buy one because I tend to keep my vehicles a long time. *2002 Silverado / *2006 Mazda3 / * 2012 Genesis sedan <> all bought new by me
<> My dilemma is that I am still trying to decide what I want and it has to be a manual for me!

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[Baldilocks]

Fuelly says Mazda3 is 29.8 vs. Honda's 33.4 so it's not such a big difference. The Mazda3 hatch would definitely be 2nd on my list of hatches to buy, I admit I'm tired of Civic road noise it's very annoying I don't know how much better the Mazda would be. Probably can't lose with a new manual Mazda3 but do their hatches come with a manual option? I notice Doug DeMuro gave the Mazda3 hatch a Doug score of 51 but the 2022 Civic EX Sedan only got a 40!

I usually turn off his videos when he starts scoring them. His scores are very arbitrary. It's kind of like "Who's Line Is It Anyway", where everything is made up and the points don't matter.

 

[ebhaynz]

Problem with Mazda3 ... Manual is only available in one trim ... Premium Hatchback ... No lower trims at all and not in any sedan!
Quiet? Yes the Mazda3 Premium Hatchback is very quiet. I just didn't feel any excitement driving it compared to my 2006 smaller engine 5 speed sedan. I was expecting more. I like Mazda3 having the naturally aspirated motor and would have definitely bought a Mazda3 sedan if they had a manual. I am unsure about the Hatchback model for looks and back seat room. Just me.
... I did try an SI last year and I loved the way it drove. But I have never owned a turbo assisted motor and was unsure whether I wanted to buy one because I tend to keep my vehicles a long time. *2002 Silverado / *2006 Mazda3 / * 2012 Genesis sedan <> all bought new by me
<> My dilemma is that I am still trying to decide what I want and it has to be a manual for me!

Yes, it's tough to choose. I realize I'm going to have to compromise somewhere along the lines when buying my next car. Right now I'm thinking to place quiet at the top of my priority list, I'm getting old there's no reason to drive a loud car anymore. My 17 Si is great except for the lousy stock stereo and high road noise. I also realize if I make a purchase and I just don't love it I'll live with it for 1-2 years and move on to the next car. There's no absolute in today's car world, have to adapt the best way we can.

 

[RobbJK]

The mazda3 hatch is/was high on my list as well. I sat in one (never test drove) at an auto show and was shocked at how cramped the interior felt, but I'm sure I'd get used to it over time. Having mostly ruled out the Civic HB ST for my next car my main 3 options are keeping my 19' EX coupe, the new Integra, or maybe giving the Mazda another look and test drive, specifically the Turbo AWD... but I'd almost rather wait and see how the next gen Mazda3 goes at this point, hoping they'll go back to an independent rear suspension setup.

 

[Baldilocks]

I wouldn't consider my 2022 Hatch loud by any means. It's certainly not Bentley quiet, but it's not Jeep Wrangler loud either.

 

[Steve182022]

Problem with Mazda3 ... Manual is only available in one trim ... Premium Hatchback ... No lower trims at all and not in any sedan!
Quiet? Yes the Mazda3 Premium Hatchback is very quiet. I just didn't feel any excitement driving it compared to my 2006 smaller engine 5 speed sedan. I was expecting more. I like Mazda3 having the naturally aspirated motor and would have definitely bought a Mazda3 sedan if they had a manual. I am unsure about the Hatchback model for looks and back seat room. Just me.
... I did try an SI last year and I loved the way it drove. But I have never owned a turbo assisted motor and was unsure whether I wanted to buy one because I tend to keep my vehicles a long time. *2002 Silverado / *2006 Mazda3 / * 2012 Genesis sedan <> all bought new by me
<> My dilemma is that I am still trying to decide what I want and it has to be a manual for me!

Canada still has several versions of the Mazda3 sedan with a manual transmission. It is possible to buy one there and have it certified for the US

 

[MorrisGray]

The mazda3 hatch is/was high on my list as well. I sat in one (never test drove) at an auto show and was shocked at how cramped the interior felt, but I'm sure I'd get used to it over time. Having mostly ruled out the Civic HB ST for my next car my main 3 options are keeping my 19' EX coupe, the new Integra, or maybe giving the Mazda another look and test drive, specifically the Turbo AWD... but I'd almost rather wait and see how the next gen Mazda3 goes at this point, hoping they'll go back to an independent rear suspension setup.

Just curious ... What made you rule out the Sport Tour Hatch ? I do understand interest in the new Integra, if it comes to fruition sometime soon.

 

[RobbJK]

Just curious ... What made you rule out the Sport Tour Hatch ? I do understand interest in the new Integra, if it comes to fruition sometime soon.

Mostly just the idea of spending $30k on something slower than my current coupe and not as sporty looking. I'm not saying the ST hatch isn't nice, but I'm not 100% sold on the styling of the new civics compared to my 10th gen coupe, and the performance hit would bug me. The Integra (which should be out in the spring) hopefully will rectify the issues I have with the Civic Hatch in having more power and IMO better styling for what will probably only be about $3k more give or take.

If it weren't for the cramped interior and the lame rear suspension of the Mazda3 Turbo hatch I'd go that route. For more or less the same price as the ST hatch you can get 250hp and AWD but the Mazda makes a few too many compromises for me to choose it. I think the new Integra will be the perfect blend of the high points of the new Civic like its refinement and quality, but with enhanced performance and styling that can sway me from my coupe.

I'm being super picky about my next car mostly because I prefer coupes... but seeing that all of Honda/Acura's affordable FWD coupes are now dead, I'm willing to slide into a 4 door hatchback but it's gotta hit all my other wants/needs perfectly. If for some reason the Integra doesn't do this, I'm more than happy to keep my coupe and start working on some mods to keep it fun and interesting until something does come along that I like more.

To add... I REALLY wanted to like the ST hatch enough to get one. I really went back and forth on it, and I may still go test drive one when I get a chance, maybe it'll surprise me with it's other improvements. Having owned 7 civics in my 18 years driving I do have some loyalty to the nameplate, and for all the driving I actually do, the ST hatch would probably be perfectly suited to my needs. But I'm finally at a place where I'm financially stable enough to move into an Acura, and to be a bit more picky about all the aspects of my vehicle.

 

[Toprarnen]

Mostly just the idea of spending $30k on something slower than my current coupe and not as sporty looking...

I'm being super picky about my next car mostly because I prefer coupes...

Do you think it would be worthwhile to consider a car like the new BRZ/GR86? The power band is much improved from the prior generation. Another vehicle to consider might be the Veloster N. Fun and FWD with a good amount of power. Just thought I'd throw those out there

 

[Baldilocks]

If I were going to get a performance front drive hatch, it would probably be a Mk8 GTI.

 

[RobbJK]

Do you think it would be worthwhile to consider a car like the new BRZ/GR86? The power band is much improved from the prior generation. Another vehicle to consider might be the Veloster N. Fun and FWD with a good amount of power. Just thought I'd throw those out there

My reasoning for something like the BRZ/86 is RWD.... I live in the midwest... I need a fun car that can be my DD even through a bad winter and having never driven RWD I wouldn't trust myself to safely get through a bad winter in one. I need FWD or AWD. I love coupes, and pretty much all affordable coupe options now are RWD, but I just don't live in the right climate for one as a DD.

As for the Veloster N... I considered that option as well. It's a great car, coupe-like enough, performance is great, price point is fine, but the interior quality totally killed that option for me... it's SO cheap inside it's almost a crime hyundai charges as much as they do for it. The Veloster (even the discontinued turbo and regular trims) more or less held pace with the civics in terms of price, but the interior is such a massive step down compared to the civic, even more so with the new 11th gens.

I've also considered the GTI... the price is a bit higher than I would want to pay just to get all the features I would want I'd have to go top trim level which is gonna push near $40k, but I also don't fully trust VW's reliability. On a more superficial note, I also don't love the new GTI styling... it's just a bit... odd, especially the front end.

 

[Baldilocks]

My reasoning for something like the BRZ/86 is RWD.... I live in the midwest... I need a fun car that can be my DD even through a bad winter and having never driven RWD I wouldn't trust myself to safely get through a bad winter in one. I need FWD or AWD. I love coupes, and pretty much all affordable coupe options now are RWD, but I just don't live in the right climate for one as a DD.

As for the Veloster N... I considered that option as well. It's a great car, coupe-like enough, performance is great, price point is fine, but the interior quality totally killed that option for me... it's SO cheap inside it's almost a crime hyundai charges as much as they do for it. The Veloster (even the discontinued turbo and regular trims) more or less held pace with the civics in terms of price, but the interior is such a massive step down compared to the civic, even more so with the new 11th gens.

I've also considered the GTI... the price is a bit higher than I would want to pay just to get all the features I would want I'd have to go top trim level which is gonna push near $40k, but I also don't fully trust VW's reliability. On a more superficial note, I also don't love the new GTI styling... it's just a bit... odd, especially the front end.

I’d get the R if I really wanted the hottest hatch though. It’s gonna be crazy. My Mk7 R was a beast with Stage 3+ tuning.

I have the Civic Hatch Sport Touring and I love it. The styling is great and the interior is nearly perfect.

 

[Toprarnen]

My reasoning ...

Those are all fair points. Given your (assumed) budget of $40k, and looking outside of coupes/hatchbacks because we've already explored those, it limits you to the WRX (ew), GR Corolla, Elantra N (possibly a better interior), or if you're willing to top out your budget, the Lexus IS300 (meh).

It's a tough market for "fun and affordable"; I hope you find something you're happy with. Personally, I'm still holding out for an 11th gen 2nd-3rd production year Type-R, or maybe a GR Corolla if those turn out to be a nice surprise. If Acura pulls a wild card and the Integra looks really good (I'm not convinced at this point), that'll be on my list too.

 

[RobbJK]

Those are all fair points. Given your (assumed) budget of $40k, and looking outside of coupes/hatchbacks because we've already explored those, it limits you to the WRX (ew), GR Corolla, Elantra N (possibly a better interior), or if you're willing to top out your budget, the Lexus IS300 (meh).

It's a tough market for "fun and affordable"; I hope you find something you're happy with. Personally, I'm still holding out for an 11th gen 2nd-3rd production year Type-R, or maybe a GR Corolla if those turn out to be a nice surprise. If Acura pulls a wild card and the Integra looks really good (I'm not convinced at this point), that'll be on my list too.

Yea. I had some hopes for the new WRX but that styling is just ... so bad. haha. Also not a fan of the toyota or the new elantras.

I'm hoping to stick to around $33k in terms of budget. And the fact that I'm about 90% sold on the new civics, that's why I feel like the Integra will be the sweet spot in my car search. As I mentioned, taking the best points of the new civic (refinement, quality) but upping it's performance and styling game a bit, and still falling around that $33k mark for probably the A-Spec trim should give me all the features I want, enough performance compared to my coupe, styling I like better than the civic, etc. It just seems like the best option, but obviously have to wait and see the final product when it's fully revealed (first visual reveal should be coming in November).

Other random cars I also looked into were the Accord Sport 2.0T and Kia K5GT, both great FWD cars, both a bit too large for what I need.

 

[VarmintCong]

Mostly just the idea of spending $30k on something slower than my current coupe and not as sporty looking. I'm not saying the ST hatch isn't nice, but I'm not 100% sold on the styling of the new civics compared to my 10th gen coupe, and the performance hit would bug me. The Integra (which should be out in the spring) hopefully will rectify the issues I have with the Civic Hatch in having more power and IMO better styling for what will probably only be about $3k more give or take.

If it weren't for the cramped interior and the lame rear suspension of the Mazda3 Turbo hatch I'd go that route. For more or less the same price as the ST hatch you can get 250hp and AWD but the Mazda makes a few too many compromises for me to choose it. I think the new Integra will be the perfect blend of the high points of the new Civic like its refinement and quality, but with enhanced performance and styling that can sway me from my coupe.

I'm being super picky about my next car mostly because I prefer coupes... but seeing that all of Honda/Acura's affordable FWD coupes are now dead, I'm willing to slide into a 4 door hatchback but it's gotta hit all my other wants/needs perfectly. If for some reason the Integra doesn't do this, I'm more than happy to keep my coupe and start working on some mods to keep it fun and interesting until something does come along that I like more.

To add... I REALLY wanted to like the ST hatch enough to get one. I really went back and forth on it, and I may still go test drive one when I get a chance, maybe it'll surprise me with it's other improvements. Having owned 7 civics in my 18 years driving I do have some loyalty to the nameplate, and for all the driving I actually do, the ST hatch would probably be perfectly suited to my needs. But I'm finally at a place where I'm financially stable enough to move into an Acura, and to be a bit more picky about all the aspects of my vehicle.

GR Corolla in late 2022? Should be 6mT AWD 250 hp turbo, since it's supposed to use the GR4 drivetrain.

I'll give it a serious look if it's most fun to drive in class. Don't love the hatch styling, the sloping trunk ruins the trunk space and the look imo. But if it's as insiders claim, it'll be hard to say no.

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