'25 brake pedal dead-travel sticky/clunky/noisy

[kyleawestbrook]

Hey all!

I'm a bit at my wits end with what probably is more an irritant than an actual problem, but it really bothers me, honestly even more than the usual rattles because it's an abnormal and undesirable sensation through an important point of interaction with the car.

Since around 800 miles (currently 3700), my stock '25 has had this odd sensation in the dead travel at the top of the brake pedal; it feels like it sticks and clunks through that distance both applying and releasing the brake pedal. You can audibly hear and feel the sensation through the car too. Several times it has even gotten stuck within this travel, where I had to reach down and pop it back that last couple millimeters back to the resting place. Once you are building pressure in the pedal it feels fine, and braking performance is normal. I've had a lot of cars and never had a brake pedal feel this junky. After the pedal got stuck the first time, I took it to the closest dealership (I live in Dallas proper, so there are lots around), and they were like yep that feels weird, but we can't find a problem (though I suspect they didn't want to go digging). So I lived with it for a while, and then got fed up and took it to a local indy shop/tech thinking maybe it's all in my head or that they all feel like this (I won't drag him into this; he did great in trying to help!) and he confirmed his perception of the same sensation, and also felt that the dead travel was longer than on other FL5s (I hadn't picked up on that because I didn't have a point of reference for that). He referred me to another local dealership where he has some connections to service folks, and they spent a some time with it and are now saying they can't even feel anything abnormal, which I find quite hard to believe!

We initially investigated if this could be related to a fluid/hydraulic issue like air in the lines, but given this is all in the dead travel and the braking performance is normal that seems unlikely. Our suspicion is that there is an issue in the pedal assembly itself, or maybe in the beginning of the travel in the master cylinder/plunger area. Before I lose it completely and just start tearing stuff apart and goose-chase replacing perfectly good parts, has anyone else had a similar feeling and been able to diagnose/correct an issue?

Also if there's anyone else who has had a good experience with a particular dealership or service person in the general Dallas/Ft Worth area who seemed willing to go digging to solve issues like this, I'd love to know. I was optimistic that this time would be successful because of the connection made from enthusiast to enthusiast at the dealership, but no luck. This feels like an issue that if it could be diagnosed would potentially be covered under warranty, so I'm still holding out hope that a dealership could solve it.

It's really crapped on the general experience with the car; hard to avoid a terrible feeling brake pedal in normal use. Also hard to articulate how annoying the sensation is; it really feels terrible. Fortunately everything else about the car has been great, so if this could get figured out it would really transform things!

The car is still at that dealership, but once I get it home I'll upload a video which could be helpful.

Sorry for the long post, and thanks for any input -Kyle

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[jtlctr]

I would look into the brake light switch, pedal return spring, and master cylinder plunger/linkage.

 

[kyleawestbrook]

Thanks for the input! My suspicion is that it’s related to the master cylinder but I like those other ideas as well.

I’ll get a video posted once I get the car back!

 

[AZCWTypeR]

My FL5 has the best brakes and brake feel of any car I've driven (including several Brembo equipped supercars).

If the dealers are giving you the runaround, ask them to get the corporate service rep involved. Also call Honda corporate to report the problem yourself.

Worse case is invoking the Lemon Law, but that will get you frosty reception (and perhaps a necessary kick in their pants).

 

[kyleawestbrook]

Thanks for the response!

I totally agree that once in the pressure building phase of the travel, the brakes modulate well and the performance itself is excellent. My issue seems to straddle the line between subjective and objective, though the pedal getting caught in the travel seems like more than just a feeling problem.

The suggestion to involve Honda corporate is a very good one; that seems like a reasonable move if I’m not getting anywhere with the dealers in town. Definitely not a lemon law though haha; honestly I’d just live with it because the rest of the car is great.

Finally had a sec to film a couple clips; if I uploaded it right (not tech savvy haha), the first is engine running, then a couple with the engine off before the pedal travel shortens, and then a short one from the engine bay. I think you can definitely hear the noises the pedal makes in that dead travel (that clunk sound is not the pedal hitting the end of the travel; it actually makes that clunk just before). Video isn’t a great way to communicate it though, because the problem is as much or more in the pedal feel as the noise. But maybe it’ll trigger some ideas. Thanks for helping me work through it!

- kyle

 

[jtlctr]

With the hissing and fluttering noises, it sounds like something going on with the brake booster maybe. I might try, with the engine off, pulling the vacuum hose off the booster to see if that effects the noises/ feeling at all.

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