Extremely concerning data sharing by Honda and other makers about our driving with insurance/LexisNexis

[Gansan]

Sorry if this is a respost, I didn't see any other posts.

This article raised alarms for me and explains why the dealer was hassling me to sign up for the HondaLink stuff, which requires consent to data sharing.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/11/...e_code=1.cU0.FuD3.tFN1_vK7R7Hd&smid=url-share

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[Ultimateone]

They want us to sign up for the app so we can buy the add ons/subscription like packages

 

[Chilly613]

I mean, you bought a car from them. They already have a ton of your information, but if you're worried about the app, you can sign up and get it and then disable all the network data and locations like I did.

 

[Gansan]

They want us to sign up for the app so we can buy the add ons/subscription like packages

I thought it was as simple as that too, but using HondaLink means you have to say yes to data sharing. After that, if it's like what GM does, Honda is potentially sharing details of every drive you take with insurance compaies, like accelerometer data of how hard you accelerate and brake and that's a different level of detail. LexisNexis is paying for that data so it becomes an additional revenue stream.

I wanted to play with LogR, so I connected the car directly to my home wifi. That means it is able to upload my data to the cloud for their use. So I'm definitely not going to do that any more.

I mean, you bought a car from them. They already have a ton of your information, but if you're worried about the app, you can sign up and get it and then disable all the network data and locations like I did.

I'm not really worried as much about the HondaLink app. It requires OS-level permissions from the phone OS, so it's clear when it uses your location data or other features.

edit: I ordered my consumer risk report from LexisNexis so we'll see if there's any driving data in there. I've only had my new car a few weeks so I don't know if it would be in there in that short a time.

 

[AZCWTypeR]

I turned off data sharing in the menu. I'm not using Apple Carplay, Android Auto, or connecting the car to Wi-Fi. Otherwise everything works as it should.

 

[VT Skier]

According to the Honda website, you have to "deactivate" the "Driver Feedback" on the "My Vehicles" page. Hopefully turning off data sharing in your phone works too.

 

[TypeRD]

It appears to me that this only matters if you use HondaLink (which is where the permissions are). If you don’t use HondaLink, then there’s no problem…unless I’m missing something?

 

[TypeRD]

There’s no driver feedback for the FL5 on Honda Link in the US. So you can’t see trips or speeds. I think we’re okay. Accord, CRV owners, etc have to worry. Driver feedback would be a button on bottom of app- we don’t have it.

That’s my understanding too. When I logged into mygarage online (after digging around and finally finding the Driver Feedback area), it appears that only a few select vehicle models and years are listed as part of this HondaLink thing. My guess is that these vehicles (vehicle owners) were auto-enrolled when they signed the paperwork when buying their cars. It makes me think that this happened prior to legislation that now prohibits stuff like this. I never enrolled in HondaLink, thankfully. I am always SUPER skeptical of anything that says “Agree to all this fine print (that no one reads), so that we can use your data. In return you will receive value-added promotions for products and services from our partners.” Yeah…no thanks!!! Be wary of this kind of stuff, folks!

 

[Gansan]

Here's a podcast episode where the author of the article goes into the details.

https://overcast.fm/+oIe_S3l64

 

[Gansan]

Rare good news update in the case of GM:
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2024/03/gm-stops-sharing-driver-data-with-brokers-amid-backlash/

 

[Integra23]

Rare good news update in the case of GM:
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2024/03/gm-stops-sharing-driver-data-with-brokers-amid-backlash/

Oh that's good news... Hopefully everyone else follows suit

 

[Seelen]

Hey all...I was concerned about this as well.

Others are saying this isn't a problem, but that's not what I'm reading from the available settings and services.

Depite not being supported for the standard Civic, or even being listed on the general HondaLink page, the FL5 Type-R does have a modem and suppprts full HondaLink Remote capabilities (as well as "Basic" and "Link" levels)

you have to pay $10/mo to access Remote level, which is where the "Driver Feedback" features are, but it's crucial to note that it doesn't mean the information isn't being collected anyway. It simply means they aren't giving you that access unless you pay

To disable the settings that allows for the sharing to occur:
Go into General Settings -> System -> "Data Sharing Setting", where you can disable.

As near as I can tell, system updates are the one important thing you'd lose here, so I'd recommend turning this back on for an hour at least every week or so.I'm planning on doing it when I clean the car.

At the very least, turn this off before you engage in any spirited driving, especially on the track (since it wouldn't know the difference)

I don't have any concrete data, and I don't think we will until we pull our Lexis reports, but this is the best workaround we have until we're sure!

 

[Integra23]

I pay for Honda link and there’s no driver feedback on the FL5. The data sharing and modem is for remote commands to know if door is open, hood popped, unlock, etc. I posted a screenshot earlier. I wish it had driver feedback option so I could see what my mechanic did with my car recently.

So you pay a subscription to check on your door locks? Just set it so they auto lock when you walk away

 

[Clark_Kent]

So you pay a subscription to check on your door locks? Just set it so they auto lock when you walk away

It's a cash grab. I'll save my coins.

 

[Seelen]

It’s a lot more than that. Can locate my car- used it when leaving a football game because I had no idea where I parked. Can see if there are any DTCs lit, check fuel, oil life/maintenance minder, mileage. Can set a geofence and get alerted if it exits (I do this when dropping off at my detailed), can set speed alerts (same as before), send locations to the nav from my phone, etc. The Honda Link page details everything. It’s only $120 a year. Only thing it lacks is driver feedback, which I wish it had. It does much more than the key fob functions.

The fact that you can set speed alerts means it is obviously collecting those metrics

Remember, LogR is Driver Feedback on steroids. Just because they don't offer it to *you* as a feature, doesn't mean they aren't pulling and storing the data

The one grace I might extend to Honda is, since this is made to be a track car, perhaps they won't sell to insurance because it's impossible to discern track use from daily and they'd want to avoid a possible suit over that. They'd also be aware that nobody would buy their performance cars if that became public (which it now has for others)

but the data is there for them to take, regardless of whether they've found a way to shoehorn it into the Feedback APIs

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