My First Track Day Ever + With FL5! (Buttonwillow Race Track CW13)

[jdOTFL5]

Hi guys,

So just wanted to give my impression on my first ever day at the track ever at ButtonWIllow.

I ran a total of 5 sessions in the novice group, 2 behind an instructor and 3 sessions on my own. Ambient temperature was around mid 80s and here are my thoughts.

the Setup: Stock but with 15MM spacers.

My Initial impression:
So, this was my first time on the track so I didnt know what to really expect. I studied the track on both video and sim'd it for a few hours on assetto corsa to get familiar with the track. In my first session following the instructor in the lead car we were running in the 2min 50's just to get familiar with the lap so no issue there. Our second time out we ran low 2min and 30's and no issue there. So here it is my first time out on the track alone. I didnt have a timer but I could tell I was significantly faster than our first two times out. IF i had to guess I was running in the 2min and 10's (maybe low 20's). The stock PS4's are probably good for a total of 3 laps around the track before you really start feeling the loss of traction. I also feel like the suspension on the car isnt compliant enough for american tracks that arent nearly as smooth as a track like suzuka there was a lot of body roll still and just really bouncy and unsettled on a lot of corners. Oil temps never reached over 235 for me but on the 3 laps that my friend who is a track instructor the temperatures easily reached 250. Overall had a lot of fun with the car but definitely noticed some weaknesses in the suspension and the cooling. Definitely made me re-evaluate my build action plan.

Pros of the car:
- Probably had the most attention of everyone on track, a lot of people walked over to even take a look at the car.
- Great platform to start off on for a track build.
- Brakes were strong throughout the whole day.

Cons:
- Stock tires start giving out after 3 laps
- Oil Temps get too hot if actually driven hard
- Suspension is kind of hard to predict and just isnt as compliant on track.

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[OsosikMedia]

Sik! Thanks for sharing.

 

[yeaitsahonda]

Welcome to the madness! Glad you had fun.

The guy parked beside me last weekend drove a Camaro and didn't know much about Type Rs. He said to me Saturday night "Dude, you wouldn't believe the number of people that walk over here just to take a pic of your car." That felt good lol. Then I had to let him in on the fact that the FL5 is still fairly new and rare.

 

[Rhorn]

Hi guys,

So just wanted to give my impression on my first ever day at the track ever at ButtonWIllow.

I ran a total of 5 sessions in the novice group, 2 behind an instructor and 3 sessions on my own. Ambient temperature was around mid 80s and here are my thoughts.

the Setup: Stock but with 15MM spacers.

My Initial impression:
So, this was my first time on the track so I didnt know what to really expect. I studied the track on both video and sim'd it for a few hours on assetto corsa to get familiar with the track. In my first session following the instructor in the lead car we were running in the 2min 50's just to get familiar with the lap so no issue there. Our second time out we ran low 2min and 30's and no issue there. So here it is my first time out on the track alone. I didnt have a timer but I could tell I was significantly faster than our first two times out. IF i had to guess I was running in the 2min and 10's (maybe low 20's). The stock PS4's are probably good for a total of 3 laps around the track before you really start feeling the loss of traction. I also feel like the suspension on the car isnt compliant enough for american tracks that arent nearly as smooth as a track like suzuka there was a lot of body roll still and just really bouncy and unsettled on a lot of corners. Oil temps never reached over 235 for me but on the 3 laps that my friend who is a track instructor the temperatures easily reached 250. Overall had a lot of fun with the car but definitely noticed some weaknesses in the suspension and the cooling. Definitely made me re-evaluate my build action plan.

Pros of the car:
- Probably had the most attention of everyone on track, a lot of people walked over to even take a look at the car.
- Great platform to start off on for a track build.
- Brakes were strong throughout the whole day.

Cons:
- Stock tires start giving out after 3 laps
- Oil Temps get too hot if actually driven hard
- Suspension is kind of hard to predict and just isnt as compliant on track.

First of all congrats on going. Really cool that you were able to go. I had plans to go this summer but have had some personal issues so I am going to try later in the fall.

250F really isn't bad in terms of oil temps, thats pretty normal for any car if you are driving it hard. I can get my GT350 to reach those temps just from driving on the street.

Are your tires completely toast and need to be replaced? Did you do any track prep like changing out the brake fluid? I know thats one thing a lot of people recommend to do at the bare minimum.

 

[jdOTFL5]

First of all congrats on going. Really cool that you were able to go. I had plans to go this summer but have had some personal issues so I am going to try later in the fall.

250F really isn't bad in terms of oil temps, thats pretty normal for any car if you are driving it hard. I can get my GT350 to reach those temps just from driving on the street.

Are your tires completely toast and need to be replaced? Did you do any track prep like changing out the brake fluid? I know thats one thing a lot of people recommend to do at the bare minimum.

Thanks! they are not completely toast but i do feel a vibration coming through the steering wheel now. I'm starting to think its either a flatspot or a bent wheel. As far as on track, the tires loss significant amounts of grip as the session progressed. i felt the car slide sideways on turns, and there were parts where i wouldnt be able to stop in time either. I'm very lucky that in Buttonwillow it's only sand/grass off of the track i think it would have done some pretty serious damage otherwise.

I did not change out the brake fluid, my friends recommended me to change out the brake fluid when i change out the brake lines.

 

[jdOTFL5]

Welcome to the madness! Glad you had fun.

The guy parked beside me last weekend drove a Camaro and didn't know much about Type Rs. He said to me Saturday night "Dude, you wouldn't believe the number of people that walk over here just to take a pic of your car." That felt good lol. Then I had to let him in on the fact that the FL5 is still fairly new and rare.

it definitely felt like it stole the show... i went with a pretty impressive lineup of cars and it hands down had the most attention.

 

[menikmati]

As someone who has also never been to a track day, did you think the event was structured well enough for complete novice drivers? I'd like to do a track day in the future but don't want to be the person slowing everyone else down.

 

[Robert.C]

As someone who has also never been to a track day, did you think the event was structured well enough for complete novice drivers? I'd like to do a track day in the future but don't want to be the person slowing everyone else down.

They typically run a beginners group, so I wouldn't let that stop you.

 

[ScumbagRob]

As someone who has also never been to a track day, did you think the event was structured well enough for complete novice drivers? I'd like to do a track day in the future but don't want to be the person slowing everyone else down.

I am in the same boat as you and have started to do some research. I plan to start with this: https://www.hookedondriving.com/

As long as you sign up with the beginner's group, it should not be a problem at all - everyone has to start somewhere!

 

[Rhorn]

As someone who has also never been to a track day, did you think the event was structured well enough for complete novice drivers? I'd like to do a track day in the future but don't want to be the person slowing everyone else down.

Depends on what event he went to. SCCA sponsored HPDE events gave different skill levels, and you can ride with the instructor. From what I was told, CHIN is extremely beginner friendly and its worth going to an event thats local to you, I am planning on using them to go to the Sebring circuit here

Other events like Track Night America, and some open track days (depends on the track) are not as beginner friendly, and dont separate you into groups.

 

[Gansan]

Thanks for writing this up! Very much appreciated for those of us who plan on buying one and tracking it. (Or maybe considering an Integra Type S.)

I realize you're just starting your track journey and you have your mental plate full with learning the track and learning all the basics, but I was wondering how much attention you paid to your tire pressures. It's easily possible you were heating up your tires and boosting tire pressures way above ideal which would cause a loss of grip like you described. Can you share what pressures you were running hot?

 

[jdOTFL5]

As someone who has also never been to a track day, did you think the event was structured well enough for complete novice drivers? I'd like to do a track day in the future but don't want to be the person slowing everyone else down.

the event I went to separated us into different groups. The novice group which I was in, had me and another driver follow a track instructor on track to learn the lines for the first 2 sections. We did a few laps each being right behind the instructor and swapped. It was nice because it was only 2 of us which gave us ample time to follow the instructor.

side note and update regarding my wheels... I pulled them off to put on a wheel balancing machine and both wheels are bent like an oval... im sure its due to the powdercoating i had done...

here are a few photos of the car on track though hope you guys enjoy!

 

[jdOTFL5]

Thanks for writing this up! Very much appreciated for those of us who plan on buying one and tracking it. (Or maybe considering an Integra Type S.)

I realize you're just starting your track journey and you have your mental plate full with learning the track and learning all the basics, but I was wondering how much attention you paid to your tire pressures. It's easily possible you were heating up your tires and boosting tire pressures way above ideal which would cause a loss of grip like you described. Can you share what pressures you were running hot?

My first sessioni ran on 34psi, by the time I was done the tires were much higher... however, after my first session I had dropped the wheels to about 28 psi (recommended by my track instructor friend). so i dont think tire pressure was the issue.

 

[balucipher]

PS4S doesn't hold up to track duty, it's not what they were designed for. You'll feel them lose grip as they overheat and their lifespan will be significantly shortened on track as the compound wasn't designed for the abuse.

I probably wouldn't run spacers on the track. I'm sure they're safe but seems like additional stress on your suspension components.

Before you head out next time, at least upgrade the brake fluid to something like Castrol SRF or Endless RF-650 etc. High temp brake fluid is important because you'll cook your fluid and lose your braking ability very quickly and with minimal warning. I'm running Paragon R5 pads in the front and P3 pads in the rear with Paragon titanium shims on the front. A little too much for PS4S tires but good for the Kumho V730 tires on my track wheels. I did as much of a track alignment as I could - popped out the locator bolt from the top hat of the front struts and maxed out camber with 0 toe and factory caster. Camber helps save the outer edge of your tire from wearing out on track during the harder turns, and as long as your toe is in check, you won't wear out your tires much faster.

I also switched to a heavier oil - Amsoil Signature Series 0w40 this time - to help handle the higher temps track duty brings better. Not sure if this was necessary yet, but we'll see.

Get back out on track and really push the car, it's fun and as long as you listen to your instructor, it's pretty safe. You develop a new appreciation for what your car can do and develop your skills as a driver. Don't focus on lap times or being faster than other drivers - focus on being smooth through every input (steering, brake, throttle, shifting) and the speed will come in due course. I never tracked my cars when I lived in CA so I'm jealous of you running Buttonwillow, what a fun looking track.

 

[Rhorn]

PS4S doesn't hold up to track duty, it's not what they were designed for. You'll feel them lose grip as they overheat and their lifespan will be significantly shortened on track as the compound wasn't designed for the abuse.

I probably wouldn't run spacers on the track. I'm sure they're safe but seems like additional stress on your suspension components.

Before you head out next time, at least upgrade the brake fluid to something like Castrol SRF or Endless RF-650 etc. High temp brake fluid is important because you'll cook your fluid and lose your braking ability very quickly and with minimal warning. I'm running Paragon R5 pads in the front and P3 pads in the rear with Paragon titanium shims on the front. A little too much for PS4S tires but good for the Kumho V730 tires on my track wheels. I did as much of a track alignment as I could - popped out the locator bolt from the top hat of the front struts and maxed out camber with 0 toe and factory caster. Camber helps save the outer edge of your tire from wearing out on track during the harder turns, and as long as your toe is in check, you won't wear out your tires much faster.

I also switched to a heavier oil - Amsoil Signature Series 0w40 this time - to help handle the higher temps track duty brings better. Not sure if this was necessary yet, but we'll see.

Get back out on track and really push the car, it's fun and as long as you listen to your instructor, it's pretty safe. You develop a new appreciation for what your car can do and develop your skills as a driver. Don't focus on lap times or being faster than other drivers - focus on being smooth through every input (steering, brake, throttle, shifting) and the speed will come in due course. I never tracked my cars when I lived in CA so I'm jealous of you running Buttonwillow, what a fun looking track.

Im always hesitant to get better tires just because I feel like at my level it really won't even matter.

Did you change the brake fluid yourself or did you get it done. Im in the process of building up my tools (thinking about getting a Quick Jack) and I'd like to learn how to bleed the brakes on my car, but I would be more convivent to take it to a shop and get it done. My only worry is that idk if they'd actually do it right and torque it down to the proper specs.

As far the 0W-40, I actually talked about different grades of oil in another thread but I met a FK8 owner who tracks his car regularly and he told me that he uses. Motul 300V, he says that it matters more about the quality of the oil, even if its thin as long as its high quality it will be fine. My question for the oil is, would running 0W-40 affect your warranty if something was to go bad? I looked into running the Motul 300V but Motul oils are not API certified (because its for racing, not street driving). I remember reading somewhere that Honda requires an API certification for oil. The guys FK8 is out of warranty so its not an issue for him.

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