11th gen Civic ?

[schmiddr2]

Don't assume the 1.5T is gonna be the only engine in the lineup or talk like it is, in Canada for example the 2019 EX has... You probably didn't guess it, the 2.0L. the 1.5T sells well in the US among enthusiasts but the 2.0L sells better elsewhere. Not sure why the part about being ktuned is included, all ECUs can be tuned/flashed. They're computers.

That being said, I hope they do what Toyota(?) Did and include a mechanical launch gear that shifts to the CVT after. Mightve been another company but my mind is thinking Toyota was the one.

I can see how that is likely. BUT it is the most capable and efficient engine of the 2. I spent $400 on Ktuner and got a heap of power gain and the CVT is smooth (enough). And i didn't mean if Ktuner would work with the ECU, but if it would also be able to set parameters for the electrical motor.

The direct shift looks like a good rethink for reliability and probably a smoother response. To me Honda has never been the smoothest car; that's Toyota.

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[Aurelleah]

I can see how that is likely. BUT it is the most capable and efficient engine of the 2. I spent $400 on Ktuner and got a heap of power gain and the CVT is smooth (enough). And i didn't mean if Ktuner would work with the ECU, but if it would also be able to set parameters for the electrical motor.

The direct shift looks like a good rethink for reliability and probably a smoother response. To me Honda has never been the smoothest car; that's Toyota.

Thanks for clarifying that you were talking about the electric assist lol. I think a mechanical launch gear would be a much better option than electric assist, as that would make the civic essentially a hybrid. It'd be pretty complex, lots to break, if you wanted recharge to be done by braking. If not by braking but from an alternator, the added resistance onto the serpentine belt would probably reduce performance/fuel economy overall.

Definitely not trying to make this a competition between the two engine types but the efficiency difference between the 2 engines is pretty small, Honda makes an extremely efficient NA engine lol, everything from the scavenging to cylinder design to integrated exhaust manifold makes it keep up efficiency-wise to the Turbo. But either engine would benefit greatly from a mechanical launch gear!

 

[schmiddr2]

Thanks for clarifying that you were talking about the electric assist lol. I think a mechanical launch gear would be a much better option than electric assist, as that would make the civic essentially a hybrid. It'd be pretty complex, lots to break, if you wanted recharge to be done by braking. If not by braking but from an alternator, the added resistance onto the serpentine belt would probably reduce performance/fuel economy overall.

Definitely not trying to make this a competition between the two engine types but the efficiency difference between the 2 engines is pretty small, Honda makes an extremely efficient NA engine lol, everything from the scavenging to cylinder design to integrated exhaust manifold makes it keep up efficiency-wise to the Turbo. But either engine would benefit greatly from a mechanical launch gear!

Just like Toyota is trying to solve takeoff by adding their launch gear to the CVT, I was thinking the elec motor would offer a similar result. Nothing to do with efficiency. Just a small motor to add responsiveness at 0-10 mph, no regen - just a battery, controller, and motor. I like that Toyota is addressing the issue, and CVT deserves the R/D investment.

BTW, if anyone is interested in Toyota Lanuch Gear this was a good read: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/...ota-corolla-hatchbacks-direct-shift-cvt-work/

 

[Dis4Damion]

I don't know the life cycle of Honda models, when do you think 11th gen will be out?
average life cycle of each generation was around 4-5 years... 10th gen is out since 2016... so is it by 2020 ?

I predict 2021, we'll likely just get the sedan and the hatchback too.

 

[integra15]

Every 5 years - but given the decline of sedans they could stretch it out an extra year as there isn't as many competitors.

So, 10th civic 2016 model year, 2017, 2018, 2019 (refresh) 2020 (limited edition), 2021 (New), or 2022 (New)

bare in mind cars can be released as a new model year every January so the earliest they will arrive is Jan 2020 or Jan 2021 depending on the market.

 

[Aurelleah]

Just like Toyota is trying to solve takeoff by adding their launch gear to the CVT, I was thinking the elec motor would offer a similar result. Nothing to do with efficiency. Just a small motor to add responsiveness at 0-10 mph, no regen - just a battery, controller, and motor. I like that Toyota is addressing the issue, and CVT deserves the R/D investment.

BTW, if anyone is interested in Toyota Lanuch Gear this was a good read: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/...ota-corolla-hatchbacks-direct-shift-cvt-work/

I'm aware of what you meant but Honda won't do things "just to increase responsiveness" if it doesn't benefit them in another way. They did turbo and CVT both for EPA emissions reasons. Toyota did a launch gear because direct drive is more efficient than a CVT during takeoffs and dead stops. These things do make it more fun to drive too, but they won't do it if it won't benefit them another way (increased sales, easier time meeting stricter regulations). An electric start assist would be more complicated to implement than you think honestly. You have to tie the motor into the transmission so it'd take a whole new transmission design, a clutch system to disengage it, gearing to link the motor output shaft to the transmission drive shafts and sheaves, a way to charge the battery (regenerative braking, or belt driven alternator), plus all the sensors, computer programming, and electronic controls to make it happen and the R&D to actually develop an efficient system. Any electric motor start assist turns the car into a hybrid, with all the things that go with it. I can guarantee that they won't do this for the civic. I can see a launch gear being added, but I can't see them turning the civic into a hybrid.

 

[racer]

judging how Europe and China are moving towards ending Internal Combustion Engine (ICE) use by 2030-2040, I would suspect a minimal refresh while development shifts towards a more electrified product, also perhaps a self driving unit. Might get only 1 more generation of "typical" civic.. 2021 or so..

 

[Design]

The assumption is as follows:

• Hatch/CTR/Si external refresh: MY 2020, available late 2019
• 11th Gen Coupe/Sedan: MY 2021, available October 2020
• 11th Gen Hatch: MY 2022, available October/November 2021

 

[WhiteCastleKid]

I know they are working on a new dual port injected engine...1.8t?

 

[theblackdogman]

Jeep actually has a small electric motor to address the spooling issue on their 2.0 turbo Wrangler and it works great.

 

[geeeek]

I think 10th gen will go for 6 years like 8th. I really wish they’d bring back smaller cars, the EP3 (7th gen Si in usa) looked amazing. Honda fit just isn’t the same, it looks too tall and narrow in comparison, not to mention busier styling

 

[Trulys_er]

Any thoughts on what the 11th gen powertrain will look like?

I would guess late 2021 for the debut. Powertrain probably wont change all that much.

 

[coo1rim]

Toyota's been doing duel injection for decades. If Honda wants it for their small Turbo, I'd try to make a deal with the local bully.. Also wondering when Honda is going to bring back the CRX. Given the huge improvement they've made with their chassis, it'd make for a wicked 2 seater at compact prices... Perhaps a good platform to do a joint effort for a new small duel-injection turbo engine. However, for the NA 2.0L engine, given how efficient and seasoned that K-Series engine has become, adding additional injection would be a waste

I'm looking forward to 2021. Seems like all the Japanese manufactore are ready to throw their knock-out punch...

 

[Shankmeyster]

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