For those who are running a tune and have emissions inspection.

[jtlctr]

Apologies for the length of this post, it's a long one.

I'm hoping to help others avoid the hassle I just went through. It seems more and more states are adopting stricter emissions standards for state inspection. I just went through quite an ordeal in MA after being flagged for "tampering" during my annual inspection. I recommend you do your homework before inspection if you are running an aftermarket tune in one of these strict states. Here's what happened to me:

At the end of May, I went in for my annual inspection at a Honda dealer because my usual inspection shop was closed and I happened to be driving by (turns out, this kind of worked in my favor in the end). So after about 45 minutes of waiting, one of the service guys and the inspection tech come walking up to me with somber looks. "Well, we have some news about your Type R..." All of a sudden I felt like I was in a hospital waiting room about to get the surgeons report on my beloved! Then he asks if I've ever had the cars computer modified because the state inspection system had automatically rejected and flagged the car for further inspection. I didn't really want to say yes, but I knew it was pointless to lie. Anyhow, what happened was that the catalyst monitor had been turned off when it was supposed to be active. Evidently, Hondata may have a glitch where, after a software update, a monitor that was previously on can get turned off and vice versa. I had always assumed that when a monitor is turned off, it would read as "not ready" which would also happen temporarily after disconnecting the battery, etc. no big deal. Instead, a monitor turned off reads as "not supported". Once the MA state inspection system sees this, it automatically flags the car as being tampered with, and you're screwed. At this point, the car is uninspectable until you make an appointment with the Motorist Assistance Center (MAC) which is basically a super inspection where they look for any visible mods, and scan the ECU for the calibration ID and calibration verification number (CVN). As I understand it, any modified programming will come up with a different CVN than OEM, which tells them it's tuned. Then they compare those numbers to all other registered vehicles of the same kind in the state. If the numbers match most or all the other cars, you're good to go because that tells them the programming is legit. If not, they can make you go to the dealer for a reflash and bring them the receipt to prove it's back to stock. Then the numbers get scanned again and verified.

The guys at the MAC kept telling me that all but one CTR they had seen were unable to flash back to stock with Hondata, and had to get the dealer to reflash it. This didn't make sense to me as Hondata states that their "return to stock" program is 100% factory. I was able to pass by using the "Return to Stock" option, then unlocking the Flashpro from the ECU, but not without some extra hassle. The first MAC inspection after returning to stock through Hondata showed 13 matches to other CTRs in state, but they say there are about 600 registered (this must include FK8s). I think this was because Hondata issues the latest OEM software for "return to stock", and Honda updated the FL5 software just a few months ago and therefore, only a few examples of the update existed in the wild. But with such a low match count, they wouldn't lift the flag without Honda themselves verifying the legitimacy of the programming. So I called the service guy at Honda who was there when the car failed, and explained that I needed to have the ECU programming verified as being OEM. He said to come by anytime, so I showed up after lunch that day. After I pulled into the bay, 2 service managers, the service director, and a tech all gathered round as I told them my predicament and what I needed to show the MAC. They were all looking a little confused and said that this was a first! These guys were all super cool though. The service director basically said "I got you, Fam". Thirty minutes later, a service guy walks in with a thumb up. The director then shows me a ream of paperwork that he printed up for me, anything he could think of to show that yes, this programming is what should be there. I was beside myself with relief, because I was afraid they would have to reflash it, which probably relocks the ECU.

Here's my favorite part: After thanking the service director about 75 times, I asked "what do I owe you?"
His response: "Nothing, just keep the enthusiasm going for these cars, I love to see it". I nearly hugged the guy after that.

Then I call the guy at the MAC and he has time to look at the car that afternoon. I show up, he scans the ECU, copies my paperwork from Honda, and lifts the inspection flag. Then we stood there chatting for a long time (great guy just doing his job) where he tells me that he had seen an Audi that week that was unable to be returned to stock, and had to have a new $3,000 ECU in order to pass inspection.

The next morning, I returned to the Honda dealer for the reinspection, and now I have a sticker!

All in all, this ordeal cost me nearly 2 full days of work, an evening of reinstalling the stock DP and intake, and a few hundred miles of driving back and forth to the MAC station halfway across the state. On the upside, I learned a lot about the current inspection process, and I found a Honda service department that I like.

So, if your state is following California emissions laws, make sure you've got everything in order before inspection. Probably best to return to stock if you want to be on the safe side. At the very least, make sure your OBD2 monitors are active and match what your car is supposed to have. No more, no less. I don't think they are actually monitoring calibration ID and verification numbers during routine inspections in MA, but I was told that info gets recorded every time and can be looked at later.

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[Chilly613]

This would be one of the times I'm glad I'm in California. We do not have to have emissions testing on brand new cars for 8 years.

 

[blueroadster]

Seems like they are scanning for changes already reported to the mothership via the TCU and reading readiness codes stored over time. Reading readiness codes or sniffing exhaust emissions is one thing. What would your state inspection office do if they could not establish communications via the OBD-II port?

 

[UCF120]

What a headache honestly. If inspections ever came to Florida I would just leave my car stock and never mess with it. Just seems like a pain in the ass to have to deal with every year

 

[AZCWTypeR]

MA switched to a more invasive emissions check about 10 years ago. Before that, my son's tuned GTI got through. Afterward, the MA computers spotted the tune and he had to revert to stock (at least for the check).

I lived in CT and my FR-S tune was never flagged. The FR-S tune modified numbers in lookup tables and nothing else. CT's emission check system didn't recognize the differences

Though my current cars are stock (for now), I'm glad I moved to an area without emissions checks.

 

[jtlctr]

Seems like they are scanning for changes already reported to the mothership via the TCU and reading readiness codes stored over time. Reading readiness codes or sniffing exhaust emissions is one thing. What would your state inspection office do if they could not establish communications via the OBD-II port?

My TCU is disconnected. They are reading the monitor status through the OBD-2 port. If they can’t connect, or any monitors show “not ready” they simply fail the car and give you 60 days to get it repaired. But the only way a supported monitor reads “unsupported” is if it’s turned off in the programming.
This is the first inspection report:

Then I had the catalyst monitor turned back on and attempted the reinspection.
They handed me this:

This is the report that passed, but only after they verified that the numbers were correct as well.

I’m pretty sure it would have passed if the Catalyst monitor was on to begin with, but because it wasn’t, they know that someone has been naughty, and they scan the ECU for calibration ID and CVN to compare with all other FL5s registered in the state. Now, if everyone banded together and got the same exact tune on day 1 before their initial inspection, then all the numbers would jive and we’d have one over on the man!

Another thing that gets people busted is when a tuner forces all monitors to read “ready”. So if the inspection system sees a monitor reading “ready” when it should read “unsupported” that also flags the car.

 

[DastardlyDave]

I hate to see this. The overall emissions from personal vehicles is negligible compared to the pollution that large factories and other industries pump out, yet we get squeezed.

 

[jtlctr]

I hate to see this. The overall emissions from personal vehicles is negligible compared to the pollution that large factories and other industries pump out, yet we get squeezed.

It’s funny, that was exactly what the inspector at the MAC station said. But as is the case with so many laws, it seems to be more about optics than reality. For instance, vehicles that are over 15 years old are exempt from emissions testing. So a good percentage of vehicles in MA are free to emit away if they like.
I would like to see a system where, for modified cars, you just have to get a true tailpipe emissions test to make sure the vehicle is running clean. I’m sure my tuned car with the TSP downpipe ran just as clean (or close to it) as it did stock.
I’d be happy to pay an extra fee for that option. This is how they used to test all cars.

 

[ThunderPigeon]

Moral of the story is if you live in one of these places pony up for a DP that won't throw a code.

 

[jtlctr]

That’s what I did, and it’s a good idea because the catalyst monitor can be left on which should be enough to pass. However, because that monitor was accidentally shut off in my case, the state clocked the tune. When referred to the next level inspection due to tuning, they then look for visible mods, like downpipes, as well as doing the ECU deep dive.

 

[Nothing]

It’s funny, that was exactly what the inspector at the MAC station said. But as is the case with so many laws, it seems to be more about optics than reality. For instance, vehicles that are over 15 years old are exempt from emissions testing. So a good percentage of vehicles in MA are free to emit away if they like.
I would like to see a system where, for modified cars, you just have to get a true tailpipe emissions test to make sure the vehicle is running clean. I’m sure my tuned car with the TSP downpipe ran just as clean (or close to it) as it did stock.
I’d be happy to pay an extra fee for that option. This is how they used to test all cars.

If I recall, it was the coal rollers that ruined the party. Really bad optics, and unquestionably considerable CO and particulate emissions for any personal use car. Though, some of the semi tractors often look the same.

Thanks for posting your experience, I've been on the fence on tuning for being stuck in this eventuality and having to deal with the headache. Question is, could this be self-tested beforehand with an obd scanner (like autel md806) and can be addressed with tuner before the actual test? Or does it require the $2000 tools only pros use?

 

[jtlctr]

If I recall, it was the coal rollers that ruined the party. Really bad optics, and unquestionably considerable CO and particulate emissions for any personal use car. Though, some of the semi tractors often look the same.

Thanks for posting your experience, I've been on the fence on tuning for being stuck in this eventuality and having to deal with the headache. Question is, could this be self-tested beforehand with an obd scanner (like autel md806) and can be addressed with tuner before the actual test? Or does it require the $2000 tools only pros use?

Yes, you absolutely can look at the relevant info with a scan tool. Any cheap code reader will show monitor status, which may be all you need. However, I see you are in California where they might actually be checking software data during routine inspection, you would have to look into that. In order to look at the software info, you need a scan tool that supports mode 9 Which I think that Autel does. The Flashpro software has all that functionality as well. Recording the calibration ID and CVN before any changes are made would be a good idea. Then you can compare that to the numbers that exist after the tune.
Aren’t you exempt from smog testing for the first 8 years though?
In any case, I recommend researching as much as possible before diving in.

 

[AlumiYJ]

Seems like they are scanning for changes already reported to the mothership via the TCU and reading readiness codes stored over time. Reading readiness codes or sniffing exhaust emissions is one thing. What would your state inspection office do if they could not establish communications via the OBD-II port?

Another reason I’m happy I disconnected my TCU. Turned on the Honda app stuff, and went to turn it off after I learned they sell data and such. Phone told me to turn off data sharing in the car, car told me to do it in the phone. Figured they can’t get any data from the car if it can’t talk to the network, and pulled the unit lol

didn’t know they were looking for tuned cars via the TCU tho.

 

[Nothing]

Yes, you absolutely can look at the relevant info with a scan tool. Any cheap code reader will show monitor status, which may be all you need. However, I see you are in California where they might actually be checking software data during routine inspection, you would have to look into that. In order to look at the software info, you need a scan tool that supports mode 9 Which I think that Autel does. The Flashpro software has all that functionality as well. Recording the calibration ID and CVN before any changes are made would be a good idea. Then you can compare that to the numbers that exist after the tune.
Aren’t you exempt from smog testing for the first 8 years though?
In any case, I recommend researching as much as possible before diving in.

As long as I can revert before smog, it's all good. But if they're going to be able to look at flash counters or checksum that isn't straightforward to verify before going in for a test, that's a headache. At this point others have said as long as you flash back to stock tune and drive long enough through drive cycles to reset obd flags, it's ok. We should know how this goes by now based on other cars, FK8 is hitting 8 years.

I plan on keeping the car, I know others say they sell their cars before it's up for smog. Of course, CA is always a moving target...

 

[jtlctr]

Another reason I’m happy I disconnected my TCU. Turned on the Honda app stuff, and went to turn it off after I learned they sell data and such. Phone told me to turn off data sharing in the car, car told me to do it in the phone. Figured they can’t get any data from the car if it can’t talk to the network, and pulled the unit lol

didn’t know they were looking for tuned cars via the TCU tho.

I'm sure Honda could see if the ECU had been flashed via the TCU, but there's no evidence that states are doing this for inspection (yet). All they need to see comes straight from the ECU when they connect to your OBD-2 port.

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