Oil filter question

[blueroadster]

I just use the OEM filters. If not available, WIX XP.

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[zumbooruk]

I dunno about all the data but I know for a fact, amsoil filters flow like shit and aren’t preferred in Motorsports due to that. They do filter very well tho

no offense to anyone here. I love their oil but not a fan of their oil filters myself for my car.

I wonder if anything else there was wrong

I told grok to look only at formal verified test results and manufacturer's data, and not consider any anecdotal user reports or opinions. however, I neglected to tell it to only use "quantifiable numeric data" and not "high" "low" etc.

here is the new table with numeric data:

Filter Model (Brand)	Filtration Efficiency	Particle Size Filtered	Dirt Holding Capacity	Oil Flow	Bypass Valve Pressure
Fram Ultra Synthetic XG7317	99.96%	20 microns	13.6 grams	5.23 psid at 30 LPM	13 PSI
Amsoil EA15K20	98.7%	20 microns	25 grams	9-11 GPM	12-16 PSI
Bosch Premium 3323	99%	20 microns	14 grams	9-11 GPM	8-11 PSI
Royal Purple 10-2867	99.08%	20 microns	10.1 grams	8.84 psid at 30 LPM	12-16 PSI
ACDelco Gold PF2057	96.49%	20 microns	9.1 grams	6.82 psid at 30 LPM	8-11 PSI
Fram Synthetic Endurance FE7317	99%	20 microns	25 grams	9-11 GPM	11-17 PSI
Mobil 1 M1-110	99.6%	25 microns	28 grams	9-11 GPM	12-16 PSI
Purolator Boss PBL14610	61.80%	20 microns	12.5 grams	6.82 psid at 30 LPM	14-18 PSI
WIX 57356	99%	23 microns	18 grams	9-11 GPM	8-11 PSI
K&N HP-1010	94.9%	21 microns	4.5 grams	9-11 GPM	12-16 PSI
Honda OEM 15400-PLM-A02 (Honeywell/Fram)	95%	20 microns	13 grams	9-11 GPM	11-17 PSI

 

[zumbooruk]

next I asked it to compare quantifiable flow and psid:

Filter Model (Brand)	Hot PSID at 3 GPM	Hot PSID at 11 GPM	Cold PSID at 3 GPM	Cold PSID at 11 GPM	Bypass Valve Pressure	Other Flow Notes
Amsoil EA15K20	1.3 PSI	12.3 PSI	7.8 PSI	43.9 PSI	12-16 PSI	Highest restriction at high flow; flow drops to 8 L/min after 33g contaminant load in separate test
Mobil 1 M1-110	1.1 PSI	8.5 PSI	5.1 PSI	36.6 PSI	12-16 PSI	Lowest restriction overall; 5.5 GPM max flow in additional data; flow drops to 8 L/min after 33g contaminants
K&N HP-1010	1.4 PSI	11.1 PSI	6.5 PSI	45.9 PSI	11-17 PSI	Moderate restriction; flow drops to 8 L/min after 17g contaminants
Fram XG7317 Ultra Synthetic	1.2 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	9.2 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	6.7 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	41.5 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	13 PSI	Balanced; max flow 9-11 GPM; flow drops to 8 L/min after 33g contaminants; 24 PSI total restriction in pump test
Royal Purple 10-2867	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	12-16 PSI	No PSID data in tests; marketed flow not quantified
Mann HU 719/7 (high-flow equivalent)	1.2 PSI	9.2 PSI	6.7 PSI	41.5 PSI	8-11 PSI	Low restriction; used as proxy for similar designs
WIX 57356	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	8-11 PSI	Max flow 9-11 GPM; 22 PSI restriction in pump test
Bosch Premium 3323	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	8-11 PSI	Max flow 9-11 GPM; no PSID
Purolator Boss PBL14610	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	14-18 PSI	No PSID; flow drops noted at 6.82 PSI in prior ISO data
ACDelco Gold PF2057	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	8-11 PSI	No PSID
Honda OEM 15400-PLM-A02	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	11-17 PSI	Max flow 9-11 GPM; no PSID

 

[Deleted User 3888]

next I asked it to compare quantifiable flow and psid:

Filter Model (Brand)	Hot PSID at 3 GPM	Hot PSID at 11 GPM	Cold PSID at 3 GPM	Cold PSID at 11 GPM	Bypass Valve Pressure	Other Flow Notes
Amsoil EA15K20	1.3 PSI	12.3 PSI	7.8 PSI	43.9 PSI	12-16 PSI	Highest restriction at high flow; flow drops to 8 L/min after 33g contaminant load in separate test
Mobil 1 M1-110	1.1 PSI	8.5 PSI	5.1 PSI	36.6 PSI	12-16 PSI	Lowest restriction overall; 5.5 GPM max flow in additional data; flow drops to 8 L/min after 33g contaminants
K&N HP-1010	1.4 PSI	11.1 PSI	6.5 PSI	45.9 PSI	11-17 PSI	Moderate restriction; flow drops to 8 L/min after 17g contaminants
Fram XG7317 Ultra Synthetic	1.2 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	9.2 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	6.7 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	41.5 PSI (equivalent Mann test)	13 PSI	Balanced; max flow 9-11 GPM; flow drops to 8 L/min after 33g contaminants; 24 PSI total restriction in pump test
Royal Purple 10-2867	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	12-16 PSI	No PSID data in tests; marketed flow not quantified
Mann HU 719/7 (high-flow equivalent)	1.2 PSI	9.2 PSI	6.7 PSI	41.5 PSI	8-11 PSI	Low restriction; used as proxy for similar designs
WIX 57356	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	8-11 PSI	Max flow 9-11 GPM; 22 PSI restriction in pump test
Bosch Premium 3323	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	8-11 PSI	Max flow 9-11 GPM; no PSID
Purolator Boss PBL14610	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	14-18 PSI	No PSID; flow drops noted at 6.82 PSI in prior ISO data
ACDelco Gold PF2057	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	8-11 PSI	No PSID
Honda OEM 15400-PLM-A02	N/A	N/A	N/A	N/A	11-17 PSI	Max flow 9-11 GPM; no PSID

Highest restriction at high flow makes sense. Amsoil filter’s bypass is more “active” than most due to pressures built up by slower flow

great filter tho. It filters very very well. Great on a daily. Not so much on something U wanna abuse some tho

In regards to the Honda filter. Is that the hamp one? Cuz the hamp one is actually solid. Just overpriced a bit imo

 

[zumbooruk]

Highest restriction at high flow makes sense. Amsoil filter’s bypass is more “active” than most due to pressures built up by slower flow

great filter tho. It filters very very well. Great on a daily. Not so much on something U wanna abuse some tho

In regards to the Honda filter. Is that the hamp one? Cuz the hamp one is actually solid. Just overpriced a bit imo

not sure what you mean by "hamp"

My understanding was that the current Honda filter is a low end (i.e. not synthetic) filter made by Honeywell/Fram


Grok says:

The 15400-PLM-A02 uses a cellulose blend media and construction similar to FRAM's basic Extra Guard PH7317.

It has about 67 percent efficiency at 20 microns, which is lower than premium options like the Ultra Synthetic XG7317 at 99 percent plus.

Cut-open analyses show it has solid build quality for OEM use, with no major flaws reported in high-heat or aggressive driving scenarios. However, it is not equivalent to the premium XG7317, which has synthetic media for better dirt holding and flow.

 

[Deleted User 3888]

not sure what you mean by "hamp"

My understanding was that the current Honda filter is a low end (i.e. not synthetic) filter made by Honeywell/Fram


Grok says:

The 15400-PLM-A02 uses a cellulose blend media and construction similar to FRAM's basic Extra Guard PH7317.

It has about 67 percent efficiency at 20 microns, which is lower than premium options like the Ultra Synthetic XG7317 at 99 percent plus.

Cut-open analyses show it has solid build quality for OEM use, with no major flaws reported in high-heat or aggressive driving scenarios. However, it is not equivalent to the premium XG7317, which has synthetic media for better dirt holding and flow.

No no

I’m sorry. I did a shit job explaining. Sorry. So there’s the Mickey Mouse crappy stock filter right?

but then there’s another blue Honda filter. It’s made by a company called hamp. Internals are different. Filters better and flows better too.

sorry about that bro.

 

[blueroadster]

Plenty of oil filter choices. If the OEM filter is good enough according to Honda, I would use that or a similar filter. Most important IMHO is changing both the oil and filter at the same time and every 3-5k miles.

Regarding oil filter micron ratings, just stick with something similar to OEM. A new oil filter with claims of screening at 20 microns will screen even finer particles as it becomes clogged over time. Eventually, the media will become too restrictive and the filter will switch to bypass mode.

An example of an oil filter where claims are rather bold include TP filters such as this one (a.k.a. Mortbee or Trasko). A new TP oil filter claims screening at 1/10th of a micron and includes an 8-10 micron mesh screen at the top of the filter when it switches to bypass mode. In this case, the filtration media begins at a point where it is too restrictive and quickly switches to bypass mode. When that happens, all of the oil is then pushed through an 8-10 micron mesh screen at the top of the filter that does not have much surface area. As a result, the TP oil filter will quickly clog resulting in a not so much fun time for your engine.

Here is an example of a TP filter that is more functional as a paper weight.

 

[Deleted User 3888]

Plenty of oil filter choices. If the OEM filter is good enough according to Honda, I would use that or a similar filter. Most important IMHO is changing both the oil and filter at the same time and every 3-5k miles.

Regarding oil filter micron ratings, just stick with something similar to OEM. A new oil filter with claims of screening at 20 microns will screen even finer particles as it becomes clogged over time. Eventually, the media will become too restrictive and the filter will switch to bypass mode.

An example of an oil filter where claims are rather bold include TP filters such as this one (a.k.a. Mortbee or Trasko). A new TP oil filter claims screening at 1/10th of a micron and includes an 8-10 micron mesh screen at the top of the filter when it switches to bypass mode. In this case, the filtration media begins at a point where it is too restrictive and quickly switches to bypass mode. When that happens, all of the oil is then pushed through an 8-10 micron mesh screen at the top of the filter that does not have much surface area. As a result, the TP oil filter will quickly clog resulting in a not so much fun time for your engine.

Here is an example of a TP filter that is more functional as a paper weight.

Agreed. Even the best oil filter will go to shit due to extended drain intervals. For sure.

 

[iforgettopee]

15400-RTA-003 is the "better" Honda oil filter (made in Japan)

15400-PLM-A02 is the Honda oil filter people on the internet say is not good (made in USA)

I haven't had a problem with either one but I go for the Japan made version if it's available

 

[AZCWTypeR]

I've run OEM Honda filters on a couple Honda's to just short of 200k miles on each. Engines still purred when sold, no oil consumption, etc. Synthetic 5W-30 oil (various brands) from Walmart or Autozone, changed every 5k miles in normal commuting.

I'm pretty sure any filter will get you there, but I prefer OEM. Also my CT dealer sold 4 filters for the price of 3 which was less than M1 or K&N at the time.

 

[Ohlins8990]

I am of the opinion (which maybe wrong of course) that the oil filter really only serves to filter out rocks. I'd much prefer a filter that gets slightly dirtier oil to the bearings knowing that the filter efficiency will increase as the filter plugs. The oil itself is designed to suspend the particulate and soot tends to be soft like graphite anyways. If Honda engineers think the Fram A02 filter provides the right amount of flow with the right amount of filtration, I'm inclined to stick with it.

This is in contrast to something like a fuel injector which in modern DI engines where the debris begins to act like sand blasting to the small parts due to the high pressures involved (even worse in diesel apps)...but no one talks about changing fuel filters like they do for oil.

 

[zumbooruk]

No no

I’m sorry. I did a shit job explaining. Sorry. So there’s the Mickey Mouse crappy stock filter right?

but then there’s another blue Honda filter. It’s made by a company called hamp. Internals are different. Filters better and flows better too.

sorry about that bro.

From quick search: "HAMP" stands for "Honda After Market Parts"

the filter you are referring to might be H1540-RTA-003 which, per Grok, is a step up from the A02 (cheap Fram), and is designed for VTEC/iVTEC setups and provides solid filtration (around 95-99% efficiency at 20 microns based on similar designs) with a unique relief valve for better pressure in aggressive driving. It is manufactured by Mahle Tennex, a division of the German company Mahle, and it's produced in Japan or the USA depending on the batch. Mahle manufactures oil filters under their own name and the Knecht brand, which they acquired in 1996. They also produce OEM oil filters branded for vehicle manufacturers like Honda, Harley-Davidson, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, and Porsche.

indeed it is, per this post :

15400-RTA-003 is the "better" Honda oil filter (made in Japan)

15400-PLM-A02 is the Honda oil filter people on the internet say is not good (made in USA)

I haven't had a problem with either one but I go for the Japan made version if it's available

 

[Deleted User 3888]

From quick search: "HAMP" stands for "Honda After Market Parts"

the filter you are referring to might be H1540-RTA-003 which, per Grok, is a step up from the A02 (cheap Fram), and is designed for VTEC/iVTEC setups and provides solid filtration (around 95-99% efficiency at 20 microns based on similar designs) with a unique relief valve for better pressure in aggressive driving. It is manufactured by Mahle Tennex, a division of the German company Mahle, and it's produced in Japan or the USA depending on the batch. Mahle manufactures oil filters under their own name and the Knecht brand, which they acquired in 1996. They also produce OEM oil filters branded for vehicle manufacturers like Honda, Harley-Davidson, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, and Porsche.

indeed it is, per this post :

Correct. Only issue with the hamp is its price. Only because cheaper filters that perform the same or better exist. For folks worried about warranty, can’t go wrong with the hamp. It’s a solid option imo.

 

[zumbooruk]

Correct. Only issue with the hamp is its price. Only because cheaper filters that perform the same or better exist. For folks worried about warranty, can’t go wrong with the hamp. It’s a solid option imo.

Since I change my filter at every oil change, and keep OCI to between 4,000 to 5,000 miles, I don't believe that filter choice makes much of a difference.

I plan to keep using Fram XG7317 at under $10 each

The FE7317 is currently $13 at Walmart, though I kinda concerned about it being a "Walmart Exclusive" since Walmart is known for cheap crap...

the H1540-RTA-003 HAMP is also about $13

 

[blueroadster]

You can also buy OEM filters in bulk (most Honda cars use the exact same filter). Bulk retail price from my order this past Summer worked out to be less than $7.00 per filter.

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