KTuner 2022+ Civic Si Tune Results - Fantastic Gains!

[danfg2]

Basically Honda uses a strategy that artificially increases knock control at high rpm. What this does is protect the engine by retarding timing. The problem is, it also reduces power. If you use high quality, high octane gas there's no need for this babysitting from Honda.

the 10th gen Si doesn't have artificial knock....is this new for the 11th gen Si?

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[gtman]

So is this what allows the car to be “premium gas recommended” rather than “required”?

Sort of. Kind of. Maybe.

In a way, knock control is a reflection of gas quality. But Honda's artificial knock rise is independent of octane used. They do it as a "safety" feature, if that makes sense.

My 10th gen had this "feature" built-in and it sucked. I use 93 octane and that timing reduction (power loss) was frustrating and unnecessary. Thankfully KTuner has a setting to remove that artificial rise now.

the 10th gen Si doesn't have artificial knock....is this new for the 11th gen Si?

Yep. JR said Honda is using a similar strategy to what the 10th gen non-Si used. Another great reason to pick up a KTuner and turn off that nonsense.

 

[D-RobIMW]

the 10th gen Si doesn't have artificial knock....is this new for the 11th gen Si?

It appears there are a handful of 2022+ ECU types that use the artificial rise, and others that don't. Luckily, KTuner has us covered on a disable for it.

 

[HondaFan777]

It appears there are a handful of 2022+ ECU types that use the artificial rise, and others that don't. Luckily, KTuner has us covered on a disable for it.

Where is that option to disable it? I’m thinking I might have one of those sensitive ECU’s and have the TSP stage 1 on my non Si. Happens after a few pulls.

 

[KTuner]

Where is that option to disable it? I’m thinking I might have one of those sensitive ECU’s and have the TSP stage 1 on my non Si. Happens after a few pulls.

It is in the next release for those who don't have it currently.

 

[Syntek]

At what power levels did you guys start seeing slippage?

 

[ValkenDnB]

At what power levels did you guys start seeing slippage?

Hondata said “280wtq” but idk what that means since their dynos read high. Their car wasn’t broken in either so it’s possible the clutch hadn’t broken in either so ??‍
I’m sure Derek will share his findings soon. I don’t even have an 11th gen si but excited to see what power he can bring out of TSP stage 1 for this semi new platform.

 

[Duckky]

interesting so overall the 11th gen makes less power tuned than the 10th gen?10th gen TSP Stage 1 makes 237 WHP and 280 WTQ vs 11th gen Flex fuel tune making 234 WHP and 256 WTQ

lol

 

[Syntek]

Hondata said “280wtq” but idk what that means since their dynos read high. Their car wasn’t broken in either so it’s possible the clutch hadn’t broken in either so ??‍
I’m sure Derek will share his findings soon. I don’t even have an 11th gen si but excited to see what power he can bring out of TSP stage 1 for this semi new platform.

I doubt clutch break-in would make that much of a significant difference but if that's the upper limits regardless, it sort of puts a wrench in any plans for a clutch swaps between the 11th and 10th gen platforms.

Unless of course you're not gonna be running that type of tuned power anyway but eh, yeah. Sort of a let down.

I assumed the single mass would be able to hold more power but i guess Honda cheaper out on this generation too.

 

[D-RobIMW]

At what power levels did you guys start seeing slippage?

I saw slip as early as ~265lb-ft on my dyno with this test car.

I doubt clutch break-in would make that much of a significant difference but if that's the upper limits regardless, it sort of puts a wrench in any plans for a clutch swaps between the 11th and 10th gen platforms.

Unless of course you're not gonna be running that type of tuned power anyway but eh, yeah. Sort of a let down.

I assumed the single mass would be able to hold more power but i guess Honda cheaper out on this generation too.

This car had 900+ miles on the clock (a bit beyond what most clutch manufacturers recommend for "break-in"), so I doubt it will be much better with significantly more miles.

It looks like the aftermarket will have to step up again.

 

[gtman]

It looks like the aftermarket will have to step up again.

Which of course makes sense because Honda isn't building these transmissions for guys like us who enjoy the tuned life. But that's the great thing about having a Civic. Aftermarket support is always plentiful.

 

[VTecYoSelfB4UWreckYoSelf]

So is this what allows the car to be “premium gas recommended” rather than “required”?

They have to cater to the people who buy a $25k car but won't spend $4 more per tank to get premium fuel.

 

[OGGsr]

So is this what allows the car to be “premium gas recommended” rather than “required”?

Exactly. And in all honesty, it's probably not a bad thing. Premium gas isn't always available and you also have some people who refuse to use it because it's more expensive.

 

[mjh]

I saw slip as early as ~265lb-ft on my dyno with this test car.



This car had 900+ miles on the clock (a bit beyond what most clutch manufacturers recommend for "break-in"), so I doubt it will be much better with significantly more miles.

It looks like the aftermarket will have to step up again.

Is that about where you would see clutch clip on the 10th gen? How did that compare?

 

[D-RobIMW]

Is that about where you would see clutch clip on the 10th gen? How did that compare?

I've seen 10thGens slip the clutch completely stock, and alternatively, I've had them hold almost 300lbs-ft.

They're all over the board.

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