Trade 718 GT4 for FL5? (There is a reason for the madness...)

[fredzy]

This is so true. My son is only 2 and I remember in the first year, just going to grandma’s for the weekend meant packing the car (FK8) to the brim. Having a wife that likes to bring everything also doesn’t help. So if you have 2 kids, the amount of crap to haul increases, not exponentially I hope.

For us, going from 1 to 2 kids the gear haul went down. Because by then we were experienced and didn't bring unnecessary crap. That said, we also switched from SUV to minivan by then. A minivan for 2 kids might seem like overkill but it is among the best choices I've ever made in life. And then if you do have more, no sweat. Not to mention how easy things get once they're jumping in and out in cleats etc.

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[CTRifecta]

I drive my 4 and 7 yr old around in the CTR all the time as it's my DD. Going to and from school, to soccer practice etc. I've protected the interior quite a bit for spills and whatever but also accepted that as a DD it's just not going to be pristine.

I think OP should get the fl5 and sell the gt4, especially since he has a gt3

 

[optronix]

This thread got me realizing that the FL5/DE5 have addressed a neglected market segment - car enthusiasts who are parents who want utility and fun at the same time. With a 2 door sports car you have fun but not utility. With an SUV/van you have utility but not fun. There aren't many cars that combine fun+utility; the FL5/DE5, Golf R & GTI, GRC, maybe Kona N. The Golf and Corolla are a little lacking on trunk space for me to consider them for utility.

Well this isn't exactly true. For 100k+ we get into RS6, AMG E class wagon, Porsche Taycan hatchback territory.

The $100k+ mark panders to an entirely different demographic. These are not engaging sports cars you're listing. They're luxury GT cars at best and overrated German muscle cars at worst. The M3/M4 arguably could be (mostly because it's available with a manual, sort of...), but the G8x generation doesn't do it at all for me, they've basically become the new M5 with worse styling. I'd take my ITS over a G80 M3 even if they were offered at the same price point.

I also would (and did) take my 95B.3 Macan GTS over all those cars listed but I've already covered that in the other thread. (Money no object the RS6 would get a solid look, but not at $150k vs a $100k Macan GTS)

 

[VarmintCong]

This is so true. My son is only 2 and I remember in the first year, just going to grandma’s for the weekend meant packing the car (FK8) to the brim. Having a wife that likes to bring everything also doesn’t help. So if you have 2 kids, the amount of crap to haul increases, not exponentially I hope.

Yeah it’s brutal with two, but ours were 2 years apart so when the youngest was like 3 we got to get rid of most of that stuff. That was a happy day.

A Civic is plenty big for two car seats, I just wouldn’t buy a car before I have the kids. It took 2 years to conceive our first.

 

[JCZ5]

This thread got me realizing that the FL5/DE5 have addressed a neglected market segment - car enthusiasts who are parents who want utility and fun at the same time. With a 2 door sports car you have fun but not utility. With an SUV/van you have utility but not fun. There aren't many cars that combine fun+utility; the FL5/DE5, Golf R & GTI, GRC, maybe Kona N. The Golf and Corolla are a little lacking on trunk space for me to consider them for utility.

Well this isn't exactly true. For 100k+ we get into RS6, AMG E class wagon, Porsche Taycan hatchback territory.

But if you want a manual transmission, your only $100K+ vehicle is CT5 V Blackwing (CT4 V Blackwing for slightly $100K). But then you have the M3/4 in the mid-tier and then everything else you mentioned in the "more affordable" bucket.

Sidenote: I drove a Taycan for a bit and it is a hoot, but I dont know if I will get bored of it quickly due to lack of noise.

Good problem to have. I prefer the mid-engine balance of the Cayman/Boxster line, but it would be hard to part with a GT3.

Perhaps you don't need the X5 if you get the FL5? Given the storage space of the FL5.

As for the Type R shifter and clutch - excellent as advertised, but lighter than on the Porsche, easy to live with, but maybe not quite as engaging in feel.

The CTR is very capable - but requires a different approach than your GT4 or GT3 to extract the most out of it. Part of the fun is honing your driving technique to accomplish just that.

Good luck on the hunt. Looking forward to hearing how it works out.

X5 has to stay because of the wife

I drive my 4 and 7 yr old around in the CTR all the time as it's my DD. Going to and from school, to soccer practice etc. I've protected the interior quite a bit for spills and whatever but also accepted that as a DD it's just not going to be pristine.

I think OP should get the fl5 and sell the gt4, especially since he has a gt3

A lot of great options to think through

 

[VarmintCong]

The $100k+ mark panders to an entirely different demographic. These are not engaging sports cars you're listing. They're luxury GT cars at best and overrated German muscle cars at worst. The M3/M4 arguably could be (mostly because it's available with a manual, sort of...), but the G8x generation doesn't do it at all for me, they've basically become the new M5 with worse styling. I'd take my ITS over a G80 M3 even if they were offered at the same price point.

I also would (and did) take my 95B.3 Macan GTS over all those cars listed but I've already covered that in the other thread. (Money no object the RS6 would get a solid look, but not at $150k vs a $100k Macan GTS)

only other practical fun cars I can think of are IS500 and the two Blackwings, maybe RS3. I’d consider a Quadrifoglio if it wasn’t 45 minutes to the nearest dealership.

Typical role for the second car for people with kids is short trips to and from daycare or school, and going to sports stuff. A 2 door sucks for a kid under 3 that can’t climb in and seat himself. And even a 4 door if low to the ground is a pain. It’s why everyone with kids ends up with SUVs.

once the kids are out of car seats or using booster seats your options open up. My kids are very comfortable in our Focus.

 

[evanescent03]

i enjoyed my 718 GT4 but i wasn't able to enjoy driving it as often as I wanted. my driveway was part of the issue ... needed custom wooden ramps installed and picked up every time I went out *lol* ... still had it for about a year and got some good street and track usage out of it. the mechanical sounds that car makes in the cabin while you're driving are pretty magical... the exhaust note itself wasn't super inspiring to me though. still a GREAT driving car. ultimately, I don't miss it that much, there are plenty other good cars out there.

I shopped for a civic for a long time and couldn't find one at MSRP. I "settledd" and got the Integra Type S because it was available, but also for the extra niceties and "cleaner" looks (wife also prefers the Acura styling). i sure do wish it came with the CTR seats though! my only grip about the situation... not even optional?! ugh.

Car ownership experiences are far too subjective for me to give you definitive advice. i think you realize that you'd be in good company driving a CTR while also having a super-ish car parked at home.

One other thing I would consider .... If you were to pick one up (only at sticker, sir!) you could enjoy it for a while and trade it in if you find it's not for you. the CTR should hold most of it's value and cause minimal guilt during at trade-in ... if that's a concern ... Good luck with the decision. we look forward to seeing the photos of the new car and hearing your impressions compared to the GT4/GT3 (yes .. that's peer pressure).

 

[VarmintCong]

I can’t think of a better investment than a GT4, when the Cayman goes all EV, values will go ballistic.

 

[Rocksandblues]

Don't get rid of GT4. You will regret it. You have the x5 for kids, trips, hauling stuff. If you didn't have a people mover I might say different.

The only thing a 2 Porsche owner should be thinking about is a third Porche.
I have driven both a GT4 and a GT3. Have ridden in the new GT4 RS. For reference

The Civic is a great car. Sporty manual is getting more rare by the year. It can be fun around town and on the track and haul 4 people (kind of) But the Porsche cars are in another Orbit.

 

[optronix]

I can’t think of a better investment than a GT4, when the Cayman goes all EV, values will go ballistic.

It's a pretty safe statement to say Porsche GT car values will go up over time and I did touch on the investment angle earlier where I claimed there are many better ways for an individual to make money than buying and selling rare cars, but the GT4 has been dead for a year already. You haven't been able to buy one new for quite some time, and just taking a look at Porsche's finder tool, the values have actually gone down- mostly because they were already overinflated. Used car values in general are way down so things may be skewed at the moment.

Part of what kept me from getting a GT4/Spyder was the mandatory ADM pretty much universally. If you think it's rare to get a CTR for sticker, it's more rare to find a GT4 owner that didn't pay at least $15k over.

 

[fredzy]

the mechanical sounds that car makes in the cabin while you're driving are pretty magical...

Funny, I think this above all else is what defines a Porsche to me. How damn noisy it is. Just rolling by on the street it's such a noticeable thing. Sounds like the engine, transmission etc. are sitting exposed with no sound deadening around them.

Don't get rid of GT4. You will regret it. You have the x5 for kids, trips, hauling stuff. If you didn't have a people mover I might say different.

@VarmintCong has the right idea about not doing anything until you're sure you'll need to. Like once you've got ultrasound proof that the kid is on the way, start shopping.

OP may not have the means to toss a $50k Civic on top of the 2 P-cars. But what about a $10k fun-beater? Something like an 8th gen Civic Si could act as the backup family car, reasonably safe. It could be cheap enough to let him keep both P-cars, maybe store one and rotate them. And then you get the enriching experience that comes with wrenching on a car that you don't 100% depend on.

 

[JCZ5]

I shopped for a civic for a long time and couldn't find one at MSRP. I "settledd" and got the Integra Type S because it was available, but also for the extra niceties and "cleaner" looks (wife also prefers the Acura styling). i sure do wish it came with the CTR seats though! my only grip about the situation... not even optional?! ugh.

One other thing I would consider .... If you were to pick one up (only at sticker, sir!) you could enjoy it for a while and trade it in if you find it's not for you. the CTR should hold most of it's value and cause minimal guilt during at trade-in ... if that's a concern ... Good luck with the decision. we look forward to seeing the photos of the new car and hearing your impressions compared to the GT4/GT3 (yes .. that's peer pressure).

The ITS is a terrific car for the use case you are using it for. A lot of people don't necessary acknowledge the best car for their use case may not be the most hardcore, we often get sucked into the hierarchy and top trim must be best for me.

As for trying a FL5 and trading it back, from my experience, that option always puts you out on monies and I rather be certain before doing this gamble.

Don't get rid of GT4. You will regret it. You have the x5 for kids, trips, hauling stuff. If you didn't have a people mover I might say different.

The only thing a 2 Porsche owner should be thinking about is a third Porche.
I have driven both a GT4 and a GT3. Have ridden in the new GT4 RS. For reference

The Civic is a great car. Sporty manual is getting more rare by the year. It can be fun around town and on the track and haul 4 people (kind of) But the Porsche cars are in another Orbit.

Well I do have a third... Its a problem haha

But you may be onto something, maybe it is the car ADD and the need to replace something right away. But maybe I should just be happy with the status quo

Funny, I think this above all else is what defines a Porsche to me. How damn noisy it is. Just rolling by on the street it's such a noticeable thing. Sounds like the engine, transmission etc. are sitting exposed with no sound deadening around them.


@VarmintCong has the right idea about not doing anything until you're sure you'll need to. Like once you've got ultrasound proof that the kid is on the way, start shopping.

OP may not have the means to toss a $50k Civic on top of the 2 P-cars. But what about a $10k fun-beater? Something like an 8th gen Civic Si could act as the backup family car, reasonably safe. It could be cheap enough to let him keep both P-cars, maybe store one and rotate them. And then you get the enriching experience that comes with wrenching on a car that you don't 100% depend on.

I realize the fortunate situation I am in. But storing has its cost too. Eh, time will tell and whatever choice will be a good one

 

[ThreeD]

This thread got me realizing that the FL5/DE5 have addressed a neglected market segment - car enthusiasts who are parents who want utility and fun at the same time. With a 2 door sports car you have fun but not utility. With an SUV/van you have utility but not fun. There aren't many cars that combine fun+utility; the FL5/DE5, Golf R & GTI, GRC, maybe Kona N. The Golf and Corolla are a little lacking on trunk space for me to consider them for utility.

Well this isn't exactly true. For 100k+ we get into RS6, AMG E class wagon, Porsche Taycan hatchback territory.

Yes
I'm not a parent yet but carry my parents and other family members around all the time. I want to be able to bomb down to my in laws house and have fun, take them out to lunch, hit some canyon roads with friends, and then drive back in comfort. The BMW M3/M4 and Audi products do that too but they are dead boring to drive at normal speeds - numb and boring below going-to-jail speeds. The DE5/FL5 is a more engaging drive during normal driving, more reliable, and lower running costs.

 

[evanescent03]

Funny, I think this above all else is what defines a Porsche to me. How damn noisy it is. Just rolling by on the street it's such a noticeable thing. Sounds like the engine, transmission etc. are sitting exposed with no sound deadening around them.

yep - the first pcar I drove was a 2010 911 S... the mechanical sounds are so immersive. as loud and fun as my C8Z06 is... it sounds like some water in the ears in comparison to the GT4.

the sound is one of the things about the ITS/CTR that's the biggest shame but as we all know.. there is NO perfect car.

 

[Integra23]

I have always had a hatchback /Sportback for transporting the kiddos when I need to along with a more dedicated hauler. I had 3 car seats in the back of a HB and took it on vacation. Currently my ITS is converted to a 5 seater. I just think these are practical vehicles that can do almost everything and when its empty have a little fun.

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