How aero is the FL5 really is? And why you should probably not remove the wang

[MooMoo]

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[jcb]

Just like those without an R should not install a a huge wing (unless balanced with full car aero..front, and perhaps even with side data considered), those with an R should not delete without knowing what you are doing.....

Honda tested the car and what they sold was optimized. Their aftermarket wing is designed to be balanced too....everything else is likely a compromise unless the sellers/brand tested it - some may have (guessing Spoon, HKS, etc.). But many may not have. Unless you are racing - and even then, work with HRC products, be careful. Side winds and headwinds happen....your 30mph headwind on a 70mph freeway run means 100mph net air speed.....etc. No wing could mean, on a corner, having the rear end cause snap oversteer.....not a fun thing.

 

[Nothing]

The cfd plots and discussion are cool, and educational. Describing how the elements make the impact is also fairly generic if you don't need the numbers. These are in tens of pounds, vs the hundreds expected from a giant wang and front splitter/canards on a race car. Otherwise it's just adding drag - and that you can notice in hwy mpg. If you daily, you may still care about that.

The imbalance of aero is an argument, but in the scheme of effects on the car, it should be fairly negligible at highway speeds for the level of grip that normal highway driving demands. You will probably notice it on track lap to lap, more of the imbalance than the effect on the rear (would a civic ex be easier to smoothly drive?) but you should also expect an imbalance from slapping on racebred splitter or a voltex wing without adjusting the whole car. People race Honda fits, I guarantee you they have fun.

If you want to run wingless on street, it's fine. People may look at you funny, but if you do visual mods you know that's the game.

 

[Nothing]

Just like those without an R should not install a a huge wing (unless balanced with full car aero..front, and perhaps even with side data considered), those with an R should not delete without knowing what you are doing.....

Honda tested the car and what they sold was optimized. Their aftermarket wing is designed to be balanced too....everything else is likely a compromise unless the sellers/brand tested it - some may have (guessing Spoon, HKS, etc.). But many may not have. Unless you are racing - and even then, work with HRC products, be careful. Side winds and headwinds happen....your 30mph headwind on a 70mph freeway run means 100mph net air speed.....etc. No wing could mean, on a corner, having the rear end cause snap oversteer.....not a fun thing.

I can imagine there's discussions of how big of aero you can put on a street car for liability, in case someone changes it (or it "breaks") and spins out. When you have GTD aero and power, you charge a lot and handpick customers who aren't going to embarrass you.

 

[Sporky McGeuschky]

Me over here with my FL5 Unslammed, all.... , , ,, and .

What, me aero...?

 

[0x1d7]

Do any 3rd parties who sell to retail publish aero data on their aero parts? Not that it would keep me from buying a part for the 'it looks good' factor.

 

[jcb]

My playing with Gemini High end for a few minutes and adding some editorial:

For the Honda Civic Type R (FL5), Verus Engineering is the primary aftermarket company that consistently publishes detailed aerodynamic data (but they have not released their FL5 parts yet....), while HKS provides general high-speed testing confirmation. Honda OEM data is also available but often discussed in broader terms of total vehicle downforce.

Aftermarket Companies with Some Data:

• Verus Engineering: They are highly transparent with their data, utilizing Computational Fluid Dynamics (CFD) to optimize and validate their aero parts. For the FL5, they have confirmed they are following the same rigorous testing process as they did for the FK8, where they published specific downforce and drag numbers for components like their rear wings. You can find their technical blog posts and CFD results directly on the Verus Engineering website. Nothing is for sale yet. Hints of what we'll get: https://www.verus-engineering.com/b...-faster-without-ruining-daily-drivability-198

• HKS: While they don't always release granular CFD charts for every consumer part, they officially stated that their Body Kit Type-S for the FL5 was "tested several times at Fuji Speedway" at speeds exceeding 220 km/h (137 mph) to ensure structural integrity and aerodynamic effectiveness. Product details are available at HKS USA.

• Spoon Sports: Their testing is more focused on track-day performance and driver feedback rather than raw CFD numbers. They typically release "test reports" from circuits like Sodegaura Forest Raceway, focusing on how their aero updates (like the carbon lip and rear wing) affect vehicle balance and lap times rather than publishing specific Newtons of downforce.

Honda OEM (Factory Data)

• Total Downforce: Honda engineers have stated that the FL5 generates approximately 90 kg (nearly 200 lbs) of downforce at 200 km/h (125 mph).
• Efficiency: Despite having smaller or more subtle aero bits compared to the FK8, the FL5 is reported to have "equivalent" or improved overall aerodynamics due to more efficient airflow management.
• Accessories: While the Honda Access carbon wing is a popular factory upgrade, specific incremental downforce numbers for just the wing (versus the standard wing) are not publicly detailed in the same way the total vehicle figure is.

I have the carbon OEM wing...slightly more stable feeling is crosswinds is as far as I can go..suspect the downforce is the same....or they'd sell a front part too. A lot of its value is looks IMHO.
The Honda carbon wing (Part # 08F02-T60-100) has some changes:

• Gurney Flap: Unlike the standard wing, the carbon version features a prominent integrated Gurney flap. This small lip at the trailing edge significantly increases downforce by creating a high-pressure zone on the upper surface without a massive drag penalty.
• Chevron Design: The wing incorporates "chevrons" (sawtooth-shaped features) on its underside. These act as vortex generators, helping to stabilize airflow under the wing and reduce yaw rotation (side-to-side movement) during high-speed cornering.
• Weight Reduction: The wing is manufactured in Italy using a red polyester weave within the carbon. It weighs approximately 1.6 lbs (0.7-1.0 kg) less than the stock spoiler.
• Stability: Real-world driver feedback and Honda engineering tests indicate the wing makes the car feel more "planted" at speeds above 80 mph, specifically reducing the "shimmery" feeling in the front end that can occur in Comfort mode at high velocities. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6]

Comparative Performance

• Stock vs. Carbon: The base FL5 generates roughly 90 kg (200 lbs) of total downforce at 200 km/h (124 mph). The carbon wing is designed to increase this figure, specifically targeting improved lateral acceleration and turning performance.
• Availability: It is available through major OEM parts suppliers.

FWIW: The Nurburgring record was done with a stock wing I think.....so the carbon wing could not have been that much (if at all) better....or they would have used it.

 

[Nothing]

Me over here with my FL5 Unslammed, all.... , , ,, and .

What, me aero...?

Just need some suspension travel for rallycross and you'll have midair stability

 

[Cueyo]

So in short, people who remove the wing are big dumb dumbs

I wonder what the ITS aerodynamics are like since it's only got the duckbill.

Would love to see someone do a highly aerodynamic body kit that picks away at the downsides mentioned in their video. The fender one in particular and make the stagnant air at the front could be easily fixed I think.

 

[J_D]

Me over here with my FL5 Unslammed, all.... , , ,, and .
What, me aero...?

Oh my I love it. What are the mods you have done if any? What offset are those wheels? Any rubbing?

 

[Sporky McGeuschky]

​

Oh my I love it. What are the mods you have done if any? What offset are those wheels? Any rubbing?

Thanks.

No major mods yet. Just some RokBlokz FL5 Rally Mud Flaps (great for aero, I'm sure), wheels, and tires.
Suspension is all stock. No suspension mods.
Wheels are MITA Motorsports FKS in size 18X9.0 with offset ET +45, no spacers.
Tires are Pirelli P Zero in size 275/45 ZR18. I bought the Pirellis because they were on sale at a good discount from Tire Rack at the time. They DO rub.
Next time I put tires on the MITA wheels, I will install 275/40 ZR18 size tires.

 

[Junsupersti]

https://adro.com/collections/vehicles?vehicle=HONDA

 

[Cueyo]

https://adro.com/collections/vehicles?vehicle=HONDA

They mention how much they've changed (drag and df), but I don't think they've attached any info about what exactly they changed in different aero parts or why they made choices they did.

I mean as a company they don't have to, but it would be nice to get like a dev blog about it

 

[0x1d7]

https://adro.com/collections/vehicles?vehicle=HONDA

I was looking at this package until I watched @PointByPatrol's video -

Maybe they've improved the design since then. Now I'm looking at the AIMGAIN set, with apparently the downside of drilling into the bumper.

 

[Cueyo]

I was looking at this package until I watched @PointByPatrol's video -

Maybe they've improved the design since then. Now I'm looking at the AIMGAIN set, with apparently the downside of drilling into the bumper.

I didn't know it was that bad to install, have they made any QoL changes?

Also @PointByPatrol how has it held up?

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