Eneos oil..

[Ktrw]

Exactly. "MOAR ZDDP" is just a talking point for the fundamentally clueless.

ZDDP competes with detergent and dispersant additives in the oil. For example, heavy duty engine oil (commonly used in diesels) has more ZDDP - because it has more detergents and dispersants. Lots of guys run Rotella T6 HDEO thinking they're ZDDP maxing, but the actual layer of zinc that gets deposited on surfaces may be no different (or even less!) than a non-HDEO oil with less ZDDP. Why? Less detergents and dispersants in the additive package.

The real proof is in doing used oil analysis. Talk to me when you find something that drops the wear metals in your used oil more than another oil does. Otherwise, you've just bought into the marketing.

The "MOAR ZDDP" isn't the argument I was making at all. I agree that is a silly characteristic to care about. I was pointing out that is one reason why it isn't an API oil, which does not make it a bad oil.

I also want to point out that I don't even run Amsoil (since I'm not intending to shill for them, their marketing does that enough for them), because I think boutique oils aren't well suited to my application. I run PUP because it's good and cheap. I will likely try Formula R when it finally comes out just because Honda says it's perfect for our engines and that is potentially pretty cool.

Sponsored

 

[Ktrw]

I've only been able to find mostly old UOAs on ENEOS oil which doesn't tell me much since they could have changed their formulations over the years.

I know that Steph Papadakis is sponsored by them and runs their oil in his personal cars and racing program. Dude definitely knows his stuff, but that doesn't really tell us if it's actually a good oil for our cars.

Might be better off running something else unless you want to try it out and get some samples.

 

[Evox787]

Well, I know people will probably get mad, but I just started running Valvoline Restore and Protect on all my cars, including the FL5.

I change my oil every 5,000 miles anyway. I’m not banging on the rev limiter all day; I cruise at 75 mph. This is my second oil change, and the car hasn’t shown any changes in oil pressure or anything else.

All that mumbo jumbo y’all talk about—summoning demons with the ZDDP or whatever—needs to stop.

 

[Ktrw]

Well, I know people will probably get mad, but I just started running Valvoline Restore and Protect on all my cars, including the FL5.

I change my oil every 5,000 miles anyway. I’m not banging on the rev limiter all day; I cruise at 75 mph. This is my second oil change, and the car hasn’t shown any changes in oil pressure or anything else.

All that mumbo jumbo y’all talk about—summoning demons with the ZDDP or whatever—needs to stop.

That's a good oil. You know your rings are always gonna be clean, thats for sure.

 

[dminusBird]

Just be aware that of the products Amsoil sells, the most popular and commonly used one "Signature Series" does NOT meet Honda's requirements. It is not an API oil and does not have the API donut.

The "OE" oil that Amsoil sells does (seem to) meet Honda's requirements:

https://amsoilcontent.com/ams/lit/databulletins/g3404.pdf
https://www.amsoil.com/p/amsoil-oe-0w-20-100-synthetic-motor-oil-oez/

Edit: here are the Amsoil 0W-20 oils that are licensed by API, pulled from API's website:

wow! Thanks for the info fam!!

 

[dminusBird]

I've used their (now discontinued) Sustina line with no issues. I eventually went away from "boutique" oil after a couple of UOA's.

what is a “boutique” oil? And did you move away from it because it wasn’t good?

 

[menikmati]

I consider an oil "boutique" if it's priced at a premium and for a specific, high-performance use case.

The UOA's were perfectly fine, I just didn't see the benefit of running it compared to cheaper oil that is readily available. There was nothing wrong with it.

I now either run Pennzoil Ultra Platinum or Castrol Edge in everything.

I wouldn't get too deep into the minutiae of oil. Pick whatever works for you, just make sure to a) have enough oil and b) change it often.

 

[dminusBird]

I consider an oil "boutique" if it's priced at a premium and for a specific, high-performance use case.

The UOA's were perfectly fine, I just didn't see the benefit of running it compared to cheaper oil that is readily available. There was nothing wrong with it.

I now either run Pennzoil Ultra Platinum or Castrol Edge in everything.

I wouldn't get too deep into the minutiae of oil. Pick whatever works for you, just make sure to a) have enough oil and b) change it often.

thanks for the advice fam!

 

[Spart]

The "MOAR ZDDP" isn't the argument I was making at all. I agree that is a silly characteristic to care about. I was pointing out that is one reason why it isn't an API oil

Nah fam, what you said was:

This is true, however signature series is a WAY better oil, and isn't an API oil because it is not limited to API standard additive package levels for a given oil weight. For example, 5W-30 SS has more ZDDP than is allowed for a 5W-30 API SP oil. For all effective purposes, SS blows Hondas actual requirements out of the water since it is a great oil for DI turbo engines.

For such a great oil, you'd think under rigorous scientific testing, it would outperform at least ONE of these oils in a battery of tests, right?

• Liqui Moly
• Pennzoil
• Mobil 1
• Ravenol
• Red Line

All of which are fantastic oils that I would use myself, but given the "blows Hondas actual requirements out of the water" shilling you're doing here, surely it came in first on at least ONE test when compared to those oils, right?

No.

Not a single f---ing test was it #1.

Not oil temp.
Not torque/hp.
Not wear metals.
Not KRL (shear.)
Not PDSC (oxidation.)
Not TEOST (deposits.)

And this is supposed to be Amsoils BEST oil, unlimited by Big Oil™ and their fascist "standards."

Given that they're able to have more ZDDP because they don't cave to Big Oil™, surely they did well on the wear metals at least? No. Lost out to an oil with ~20% less Zinc/Phosphorous (838/620 on Liqui Moly vs 1010/752 on Amsoil)

Sauce:

 

[Rhorn]

I’ve done a lot of research into oils and filters and stuff over the years and have decided that AMSOIL is probably some of the best stuff out there. Just like after researching filters, I use pure Purolator boss filters based on a big test that someone did on YouTube.

AMSOIL isn't really the best, unless what you are looking for in an oil. AMSOIL main niche is that they use have really good life and you can have extended oil change intervals with them, but thats about it.

Its not like their formula is radically different than other brands, and in some cases it will shear out of grade more than others. The formulation is fine but there are other oils that are directly cater to modern small displacement FI engines. Things like fuel dilution, carbon deposits, Low-Speed Pre-Ignition (LSPI) are problems with our engines. The Amsoil Euro blend is supposed to cater to these problems but it could be better.

I think AMSOIL is really good for NA engines I used it on my Mustang and on my CTR before a bit before switching, I mean its good but its not the "best" just understand the main benefit of running it is extended OCIs, I wont be busy with grad school for the next few years so my time will be limited. Definitely going to be getting AMSOIL again because I want the extra oil life.

 

[AspecR]

Nothing like a good oil discussion in the morning! keep it going boys!

 

[ChampionshipWhiteFL5]

Eh. All the research I’ve done AMSOIL is one of the best oils you can buy. So it is what it is. Everyone has their opinion on different facts.

it’s all I’ve used for years. And I always go thicker oil as well. So then there’s that lol

 

[Spart]

The research: Amsoil's army of pyramid scheme MLM lackeys.

I literally just posted documentation of it being nowhere near the best by an expert, independent third party that runs a company doing used oil analysis.

It was never bad oil, and two decades ago it may have been the best oil, but Amsoil has stagnated while many others have made leaps and bounds.

 

[ChampionshipWhiteFL5]

No. Research. Just had a quick Google search on best oils and all kind of stuff comes up with guys doing independent testing and such. But like I said, to each his own. I use nothing but that stuff. You’re more than welcome to use whatever you want. Heck, if someone thinks water works good, so be it. They have that right, even though we live in a dictatorial society!

 

[Spart]

No. Research. Just had a quick Google search on best oils and all kind of stuff comes up with guys doing independent testing and such. But like I said, to each his own. I use nothing but that stuff. You’re more than welcome to use whatever you want. Heck, if someone thinks water works good, so be it. They have that right, even though we live in a dictatorial society!

And what Google got you was likely some sort of test featuring one of these guys:

Which is a bearing tester invented by Timken to test wheel bearings and wheel bearing grease.

Yes, grease. Not motor oil. Grease.

https://advancedinstruments.en.made...Load-Test-Machine-for-Lubricating-Grease.html

Let me know how many wheel bearings you find in your engine next time you take it apart.

It's a completely irrelevant test, engines rely on oil pressure whereas wheel bearings do not. But unscrupulous and/or uneducated folks can use that test to "prove" one oil is superior to another based on a characteristic that isn't relevant to conditions found inside an engine.

It can actually favor worse oils, because the extreme pressure additives needed to be successful with that test are often corrosive to metals found in engine bearings, which are much softer than wheel bearings and are never intended to have regular metal-on-metal contact.

And not coincidentally, it's a test favored by MLM Amsoil lackeys (note the bottle in the above picture) because it's one that favors Amsoil and is easily rigged.

Guys, this is why you have to be careful where you get your information from. Otherwise, it's extremely easy to end up on the first peak of this chart: