FL5 vs base 718 Cayman

[optronix]

No, and I’d never be a country club member because I don’t care. Lol! That really wasn’t my point. My only point is that shopping for a GTS for a reasonable price and right spec sucks. Those shopping GT level don’t deal with this pain.

Eh... the GT allocation game is in a league of its own. Porsche has effectively duplicated Rolex's game of intentional scarcity, with the only exception that dealers can and will charge more than MSRP (AFAIK Rolex won't let the dealers actually get away with that for new watches... but I could be wrong). To get a GT car allocation, you have to basically be a premier customer. I think for some of the truly rare cars we're talking 918 + annual GT3 territory. And the people who can afford them are all too happy to play this game. I thought I had decent pull with my local dealer having bought 2 Macans and a 718 GTS 4.0, but effectively got laughed out of the building when I asked about the Spyder RS. Plus they threw on a $100k markup on top of the already-high MSRP. ;

Didn't stop the sales guy (who I actually do like) from calling me a few months later when they had a used GT4RS in on a trade- for $75k over list.

I'm kind of done with rich people games. I'm not rich by any stretch but even if I was, I've been poor before and think $75-100k+ for the privilege of buying a $250k car is madness. Hard pass.

On the used GTS side- they're just flat out rare. I honestly think there are far more GTS 4.0 cars out there than the 981 GTS- but good luck finding one at a tolerable price point; almost all the ones I saw were at or near original MSRP with considerable miles on them already. But the 981 GTS cars have always been notoriously hard to find, and it's because they just didn't make that many of them. AND in my honest assessment, they have significant advantage over the 981 S cars in many ways both aesthetically and audibly; they have a different front fascia that IMHO looks way better than the S variants, and a "sound symposer" that's unique to the GTS that adds significantly more induction noise in the cabin. It is quite noticeable, and scantly documented. Also- the desirable "X73" option for the fixed sports suspension is far more prevalent on the GTS variants than the S cars (but GOOD LUCK finding one with a backup camera....)

Honestly, this conversation got me to start looking for some. They're out there if you look hard enough. But a decent one is gonna run you at least $75k, and that number will probably continue to grow. And that's assuming you're not too picky with spec.

I truly, deeply miss this car. This is literally the one that got away.

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[zumbooruk]

This, right there, is the reason to get the Porsche... 2 extra gallons

I know the numbers don't mean much for the driver's cars , but side by side comparison of the number.

Spec	2025 Porsche 718 Cayman Base 6MT	2026 Honda Civic Type R Type R
Tank Capacity	14.2 gal	—

 

[TypeRD]

@optronix Well stated. you know the game better than I ever will. Indeed the luxury goods market, as a whole, is built on scarcity and exclusivity. It has always been this way. I get it.

I’m far from rich, but am definitely doing fine. I have it in my mind that the only car that would be the next TRUE upgrade to my FL5 would be a Cayman GTS 4.0 manual…which of course lead me to do some research. That’s where reality sets in. There’s the price which is…OK. Sucks, but I could do it if I really wanted to. As I’m contemplating, there’s a point where I ask myself “Would I drive it enough to even justify this?” I didn’t grow up with a lot of money, so I will always have that sensibility speaking to me. Again, this is all assuming I can even find one in a spec I want!

That whole experience makes me just go back to appreciating my FL5 for several months, then I’ll check the Cayman market again and be disappointed. It’s a cycle.

I appreciate you sharing your experiences and sharing how much you enjoy your DE5. I, and I’m sure many of us here, don’t really know how good we have it because our experiential gauges are not as developed as yours (and a few others’ on this forum). So there’s always this lingering curiosity about what’s next or what am I missing? Based on what you’ve said, I’m not missing a lot, BUT a Porsche is still a Porsche.

 

[ABPDE5]

Eh... the GT allocation game is in a league of its own. Porsche has effectively duplicated Rolex's game of intentional scarcity, with the only exception that dealers can and will charge more than MSRP (AFAIK Rolex won't let the dealers actually get away with that for new watches... but I could be wrong). To get a GT car allocation, you have to basically be a premier customer. I think for some of the truly rare cars we're talking 918 + annual GT3 territory. And the people who can afford them are all too happy to play this game. I thought I had decent pull with my local dealer having bought 2 Macans and a 718 GTS 4.0, but effectively got laughed out of the building when I asked about the Spyder RS. Plus they threw on a $100k markup on top of the already-high MSRP. ;

Didn't stop the sales guy (who I actually do like) from calling me a few months later when they had a used GT4RS in on a trade- for $75k over list.

I'm kind of done with rich people games. I'm not rich by any stretch but even if I was, I've been poor before and think $75-100k+ for the privilege of buying a $250k car is madness. Hard pass.

On the used GTS side- they're just flat out rare. I honestly think there are far more GTS 4.0 cars out there than the 981 GTS- but good luck finding one at a tolerable price point; almost all the ones I saw were at or near original MSRP with considerable miles on them already. But the 981 GTS cars have always been notoriously hard to find, and it's because they just didn't make that many of them. AND in my honest assessment, they have significant advantage over the 981 S cars in many ways both aesthetically and audibly; they have a different front fascia that IMHO looks way better than the S variants, and a "sound symposer" that's unique to the GTS that adds significantly more induction noise in the cabin. It is quite noticeable, and scantly documented. Also- the desirable "X73" option for the fixed sports suspension is far more prevalent on the GTS variants than the S cars (but GOOD LUCK finding one with a backup camera....)

Honestly, this conversation got me to start looking for some. They're out there if you look hard enough. But a decent one is gonna run you at least $75k, and that number will probably continue to grow. And that's assuming you're not too picky with spec.

I truly, deeply miss this car. This is literally the one that got away.

The 981 GTS also comes with the LSD, which hardly anyone optioned on their 981s / 981 Ss -- seriously, it's impossible to find. But, imo, the EPS on the 981s isn't that great.

 

[ctechauto]

The 981 GTS also comes with the LSD, which hardly anyone optioned on their 981s / 981 Ss -- seriously, it's impossible to find. But, imo, the EPS on the 981s isn't that great.

981 GTS does not come with PTV / Mech LSD (option code 220). Its an option on all non-GT trim levels. They only come with LSD standard on GT trims. However, you will find more GTS optioned with PTV than S. The aftermarket easily takes care of the lack of LSD though - OSGiken and Guard are most popular.

 

[ABPDE5]

981 GTS does not come with PTV / Mech LSD (option code 220). Its an option on all non-GT trim levels. They only come with LSD standard on GT trims. However, you will find more GTS optioned with PTV than S.

Gotcha. I must have misremembered. I could only find PTV on GTS models anywhere near me.

 

[ctechauto]

Gotcha. I must have misremembered. I could only find PTV on GTS models anywhere near me.

Yup, thats very common situation!

 

[CG13]

I own an FL5 and I previously owned a 2019 991.2 GT3RS. Before buying that car in 2019, I looked at a Cayman GT4, 991.2 GT3 manual, and a 911T.

The Cayman GT4 was a bit of a let-down for me. It didn’t feel special in the way the GT3 and GT3RS did, and the manual gearing was not to my liking. The GT3 manual seemed like a poor fit between the quick-revving 9k engine and the manual. Every single one I looked to buy had over-rev instances recorded. Test driving showed me why, it seemed like you either short-shift or over-rev. This is what led me to a GT3RS, even though I wanted a manual. That engine and that car were too special to pass up and the PDK was a perfect match for the engine. The 911T was a real surprise for me. I drove it on track and it had radio delete (and possibly AC delete, can’t remember) and the carbon bucket seats. It was a GREAT car, great to drive, but I just couldn’t pull the trigger with the pricing.

All that said, I never got along with the GT3RS handling on track, and I’m not exactly sure why. It always felt nervous and I never had the confidence on track I’ve felt in other cars (GTR, GTR Nismo, Focus RS, Evora GT, FL5). Ultimately the car turned out to be a great value. I purchased used from a dealer in 2019 with about 2500 miles as a CPO for $195k and sold in 2022 for almost $50k more. That was just luck, not planned, and not something I’d expect today with the astronomical pricing of the GT cars.

The FL5 is a lot of fun, but when comparing to these Porsches, it is always going to be at a design disadvantage with the FWD setup. It really speaks to how great an S2000 could be if Honda kept it at or under 3000 lbs, under $60k, and offered a Type R variant with the CTR engine. Unfortunately very few buyers are looking for small sports cars, especially without the brand cache offered by something like a Porsche.

 

[optronix]

@optronix Well stated. you know the game better than I ever will. Indeed the luxury goods market, as a whole, is built on scarcity and exclusivity. It has always been this way. I get it.

I’m far from rich, but am definitely doing fine. I have it in my mind that the only car that would be the next TRUE upgrade to my FL5 would be a Cayman GTS 4.0 manual…which of course lead me to do some research. That’s where reality sets in. There’s the price which is…OK. Sucks, but I could do it if I really wanted to. As I’m contemplating, there’s a point where I ask myself “Would I drive it enough to even justify this?” I didn’t grow up with a lot of money, so I will always have that sensibility speaking to me. Again, this is all assuming I can even find one in a spec I want!

That whole experience makes me just go back to appreciating my FL5 for several months, then I’ll check the Cayman market again and be disappointed. It’s a cycle.

I appreciate you sharing your experiences and sharing how much you enjoy your DE5. I, and I’m sure many of us here, don’t really know how good we have it because our experiential gauges are not as developed as yours (and a few others’ on this forum). So there’s always this lingering curiosity about what’s next or what am I missing? Based on what you’ve said, I’m not missing a lot, BUT a Porsche is still a Porsche.

You nailed it. The GTS 4.0 is a magnificent car; the engine sound is intoxicating, and subtle things down to the way the steering wheel feels are notably "special" (ok, maybe not as special as the RS cars...). But I couldn't have put it any better- that sense of "I gotta get out and drive this thing" is actually a bit of unpleasant pressure I'd put on myself because I was acutely aware of how much I paid for the privilege of owning it. That got old after a while.

If my experiences can help someone skip the hard part of cycling through several cars before landing on one that just "works", I'm happy to weigh in. I spent a LOT of time on Rennlist and used car listings... and also as mentioned a couple individual orders on new cars. It was a fun experience- both the "hunt" of searching for an ideal used spec and individually selecting every option on a new spec, as well as actually owning and driving the cars... but none of it materially changes the quality of life. Seriously, all it took was seeing the design of the FL5 and thinking to myself- "that actually looks good, and I bet it's great to drive- why don't I just get one of those?". And here we are.

This DE5 truly "fits" where I'm at in my life at this point in time. But I'm also aware I'll be expanding my horizons once again at some point. I think I've mentioned a few times before, but I've currently got my eye squarely on a DC2 Type R... but if a perfect 981 BGTS pops up at a reasonable price I don't know how I'll react lol.

But plans are to keep the DE5, and only replace it with perhaps another DE5 (or FL5), depending what changes with the upcoming refresh.

Gotcha. I must have misremembered. I could only find PTV on GTS models anywhere near me.

You bring up a great point though- but the PTV was almost as rare as the backup camera to my experience.

As @ctechauto mentioned, it's not necessary. A great bonus, but not to the point I'd pass up an otherwise great spec. Also note you can resolve a missing X73 spec as well, and you don't even need to go aftermarket for it. IIRC Porsche sells the parts as a kit and it's just dampers, springs, and roll bars, for ~$1200 or so. An essential upgrade over the adaptive dampers from that generation.

Also you're not wrong about the steering. The first generation Porsches with EPS (981, 991.1) were not terrific and the FL5/DE5 is actually significantly better.

 

[CRX-CTR]

. I have it in my mind that the only car that would be the next TRUE upgrade to my FL5 would be a Cayman GTS 4.0 manual…which of course lead me to do some research.
[/QUOTE]

I had five fun cars, and I've just sold off three. The keepers were a 718 Cayman GTS 4.0 manual and an FL5 CTR. I have a separate daily, so these are both fun cars only. Both have been on top notch roads and spent some time on the track. If I had to go down to just one, it would no doubt be the Porsche. There is really something special about it. But, that said, I wouldn't cry if I just had the CTR.

The GTS feels older, wiser and experienced while the CTR feels young, pushy and fearless. Make of that analogy what you will.

Sure, they are in different price ranges, but that's only one factor in life. Things are what they cost. Happiness isn't always related to cost.

As an aside, I've heard the value play is to get the 718 Cayman S 2.5 and put a tune on it.

 

[Robo7]

Not all that surprised to see we’re on the same page. I’m looking hard at a 992.2 911T as well. If you’ve had a chance to drive one, you probably get it. It’s nowhere near the most powerful car I’ve driven, but that almost feels irrelevant. What stood out to me was how balanced it is. Sharp front end, enough power to be genuinely quick, and still some traces of rawness (about as raw as a car can realistically be in 2026). It feels like a car built around driver engagement more than chasing numbers, which is getting harder to find.

As built, mine is just under $170K, which I’m definitely not thrilled about. But at the same time, this just seems to be where Porsche is pricing their cars these days. I've already ranted about my love-hate relationship with Porsche in the past so I'll skip that part. None of this makes the sticker shock easier, but the 911T makes a strong case if what you value is feel, balance, and involvement over outright horsepower.

I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve configured the 992.2 T on Porsche’s website. It’s my favorite trim but $150k+ for a base Carrera is insane. I’m looking at 991.2 GT3s now because the price isn’t far off and I don’t think the GT cars will depreciate as much. Porsche has lost their minds with the current pricing.

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